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The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

nianticlabs.com

41–50 of 120 posts

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#41
post #7

The title and content of the article, in which Hanke espouses the virtues if Niantic Labs (an AR company), were cognitively dissonant for me. > The concept reached one of its most complete expressions in Ernest Cline’s Ready Player One, where virtually everyone has abandoned reality for an elaborate VR massively multiplayer video game. A lot of people these days seem very interested in bringing this near-future visio…

Even if it involves interacting with the real world, I've always found Pokemon Go (and other Pokemon games) kind of brutal: basically capturing animals and making them fight until incapacitated. People go to jail for that sort of thing in real life.

Of course there are plenty of game where you do things that would be illegal: GTA built an empire on it. But Pokemon is marketed towards kids.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#42
> Multiply this kind of channel x1000: Mario, Transformers, Marvel’s superhero universe, the world of Wakanda, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Bladerunner, Sherlock Holmes, Nancy Drew, The Maltese Falcon — all of these and countless more will exist as reality channels that you can turn on, transforming your daily routine into something a bit more magical, intriguing, exciting — and most of all, a little more fun. Importantly, all of these experiences will be shared by countless other people, so that the adventure is a catalyst for spending time together and deepening social relationships.

But even more importantly, none of those people you're interacting with have any agency over those brands or IPs, and their interaction with the metaverse will necessarily be filtered through a set of corporate-controlled allowed actions and responses. Those "social relationships" will be a guided experience.

When replacing or overlaying reality with IP, it becomes necessary to ask the question, "who owns the IP?"

The counter-cultural, weird sci-fi worlds of current platforms like VRChat exist in no small part because the people interacting with them have agency. They ignore copyright, they make whatever they want, they form whatever communities they want. I'm not interested in your vision of an AR metaverse if your vision of the metaverse is that Nintendo or Disney gets to put an extra layer over the real world that gives them even more control over how I can interact with it.

The author keeps talking about culture, but the brands and IPs that they're championing are fundamentally opposed to the free expression of culture outside of their owners' control, and cementing the metaverse in an "official" way that retained that control would result in a world even more restrictive than our current one. Hard pass.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#44
post #7

The title and content of the article, in which Hanke espouses the virtues if Niantic Labs (an AR company), were cognitively dissonant for me. > The concept reached one of its most complete expressions in Ernest Cline’s Ready Player One, where virtually everyone has abandoned reality for an elaborate VR massively multiplayer video game. A lot of people these days seem very interested in bringing this near-future visio…

Even if it involves interacting with the real world, I've always found Pokemon Go (and other Pokemon games) kind of brutal: basically capturing animals and making them fight until incapacitated. People go to jail for that sort of thing in real life. Of course there are plenty of game where you do things that would be illegal: GTA built an empire on it. But Pokemon is marketed towards kids .

The Detective Pikachu movie is actually premised on the recognition that battling Pokémon against their will is unethical. It's kinda strange to have that as canon, when the entire rest of the franchise encourages you to battle them and the games provide zero alternative.

On the other hand... I think your concern here is just about the worst example of pearl-clutching over video game violence that I've seen. Kids don't have a problem sorting fact from fiction when capturing Pokémon involves throwing a ball at them and the Pokémon somehow becoming entrapped within.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#45

> Multiply this kind of channel x1000: Mario, Transformers, Marvel’s superhero universe, the world of Wakanda, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Bladerunner, Sherlock Holmes, Nancy Drew, The Maltese Falcon — all of these and countless more will exist as reality channels that you can turn on, transforming your daily routine into something a bit more magical, intriguing, exciting — and most of all, a little more fun. Important…

Very good take.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#46
The biggest artificial universe, created by our smartest and most idealistic techno-utopian hippies, got subverted and then perverted into the internet of today. Now, the sort of people who did a lot of the subverting want to try again, but this time it'll be for profit and full of monetization and tracking ab initio, and I'm supposed to think it'll work out because we have AR glasses now. Yeah, that's what was missing, the glasses.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#47

> Multiply this kind of channel x1000: Mario, Transformers, Marvel’s superhero universe, the world of Wakanda, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Bladerunner, Sherlock Holmes, Nancy Drew, The Maltese Falcon — all of these and countless more will exist as reality channels that you can turn on, transforming your daily routine into something a bit more magical, intriguing, exciting — and most of all, a little more fun. Important…

Was about to reply, but this basically sums up everything I was gonna say. Well played, my friend.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t get why escaping reality is bad. Is theatre bad? Books? Movies? Providing a good escape from reality can lower people’s demands of reality, which can lead to a more sustainable future. If people can eat beans but be tricked into thinking they’re eating steak it can improve health and lower emissions, for example.

Trying to trick people into desired behaviour through escapism rather than creating a shared culture of stewardship, responsibility and self-control is exactly what a dystopian nightmare looks like. I think you should look at the roots of theatre. The principal function of theatre wasn't escapism but Catharsis , the cleansing of one's emotional state to be able to re-engage with the world and to renew and restore one…

Such great points. The tech of today is constantly attempting to rerout user back into itself. In a way this is unprecedented. A product that necessitates your constant use. Books don't necessitate re-reads, neither does a flip phone. But, the tech of today is all about consolidating your experience.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#49

Whenever a company describes their vision of "the metaverse" (or I guess "reality channels" in this case) it's always exceedingly vague and never really explains in concrete terms what sort of utility or entertainment a person would derive from it. I guess it's just the latest vehicle to get investors or stockholders excited without needing to rely upon any work or logic beyond the unclear promise of technologies tha…

The metaverse has a consistent definition - at least, if you read Snow Crash. It's just not what any company would actually want to bring to the market. 3D game worlds have value, open systems have value, but in completely opposite and contradictory ways. The value is in the entertainment of playing a well-built one, which means there has to be monetization and centralization. In other words, they have "production va…

A decade and change ago we had Second Life, a 3D game world built like an open system.

After many struggles, Second Life achieved social stability. The company has mostly a hands-off attitude and a minimal "governance" group of about half a dozen people. There are landlords and tenants, with grumbling on both sides, in more or less balance. Griefing is rare. The large-scale scams, such as a fake bank, are gone. Copying and uploading content happens occasionally but is not a huge problem. Land use is all over the place, but there are coherent communities. The main viewer is a third party open source system, and Open Simulator still chugs along, offering an option for people who want an environment under different ownership.

Ease of use is a serious problem in many dimensions. Just becoming a new users is frustrating. Upon entry, you go through a basic orientation and are dumped into a transit point full of jerks and scammers. It's like the Port Authority Bus Terminal in New York City. You've been dumped into a large city, and, other than some signs suggesting various destinations, you're on your own. It really is a virtual world, not a game. What you do in it is entirely up to you. The world is indifferent to you. This throws many new users.

Then they discover their default avatar sucks, that the clothing system is really complicated, and the good stuff costs money, or good free stuff has to be searched out.

If they make it to day 3, they'll start to get the place figured out. But the new user experience is harsh.

Most of the people making metaverse noises are not far enough along to reach these problems, let alone solve them.

Re: The metaverse is a dystopian nightmare – let’s build a better reality

#50
Everyone’s vision of the metaverse seems to be directly tied to their pre-existing business interests.

Call me when you work on several of these projects in a row and debias yourself and your financial interests from what ought to be done to create the best possible future for spatial computing.

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