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GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

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Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#421

Post by gtyras2mrs »

donny2018 wrote: post #367
bogwog wrote: post #358

Serious question: if I were to use this, would Microsoft collect analytics on me (code written, keystrokes, mouse movements, sleep/work schedule, productivity metrics, etc) and monetize that data by using it to build some AI product like Copilot, or build a productivity dashboard so managers can fire people for not being productive enough (like Xsolla did), use it to serve me ads, or do some stupid/irresponsible/unet…

I don’t know if this is a good indicator or not, but Codespaces costs money. So there is a non-zero probability that you are not the product.

> Codespaces costs money.

It's going to be paid by your employer which leads to GP's concern about,

> or build a productivity dashboard so managers can fire people for not being productive enough (like Xsolla did)

Which is more likely. If your employer sets something like this up - will they use it to calculate a productivity score and use that for lay offs? Seems rather probable to me.

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#422

Post by throwaway_fjmr »

blueplanet200 wrote: post #107
dynamicwebpaige wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Currently, VS Code is the primary method of connection to each Codespace, and we do not support other editors officially. If you’re looking to connect via SSH with your desktop IDE, we do have a workaround here: https://github.com/microsoft/vscode-dev-containers/blob/main... -- and I use this regularly for Jupyter Notebooks. :)

So if I want to use IntelliJ or RubyMine, is there a workaround?

Yeah, go work somewhere else :))))) /s

Jetbrains recently added remote capabilities to IntelliJ, I'm hoping it's going to be usable with codespaces soon.

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#423

Post by ryanianian »

gnull wrote: post #96
thomascgalvin wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An internet connection is already required for dependency management and stack overflow. I already develop with an always-on connection.

Dependency management is usually not a big part of programmer workflow (unless you are a devops or something). Download dependencies and docs, go offline, write code. People who try working offline are exactly the people who want to do it without Stackoverflow.

They're also the people least likely to want to use this kind of setup in my experience.

My company has a remote VSCode setup not that dissimilar from this setup. Big C++ codebase. Many engineers love it, even some of the "old timers." Our interns can be productive on day one and it brings a lot of productivity to not have to worry about caring for your dev environment.

But there are plenty of people who really just want to SSH into a beefy desktop (or directly edit on that desktop) and use their vim/emacs setups. These are the people who know how the whole build stack works, can debug the vscode/codespace magic, and can do amazing things not available in the VSCode plugin library.

So it's good to be able to do both. Allow power users to use their own tools, but don't require everyone to be a power user to sit down and write some business logic. Give nice rails to ride but don't require them.

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#424

Post by jokethrowaway »

distrill wrote: post #84
justicezyx wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be happy to let go of an employee who bank their employment on the preference of toolings. Hear me out: Toolings are, like the name suggests, a means to an end. If a web IDE is fast, works reasonably, and can continue improve itself. And the learning curve is friendly to engineers with different background and experience. Everyone should be comfortable to be nudged to use it. And if the tool additionally is a…

Yeah, whenever I hear this kind of rhetoric - if my company ever required it's time for a new job - I roll my eyes. Sure, keep pushing yourself out of more companies, there are a lot of good engineers* who will be absolutely as productive as you and who won't be a drain on everyone around them. *it's always engineers making these statements or I only know engineers

There are plenty of engineers but few good ones.

Hiring is brutal, especially now, so good developers can afford to be picky and find another semi identical job in almost no time.

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#425

Post by FlyingSnake »

swiley wrote: post #125
lucideer wrote: post #22

> My friends, I’m here to tell you I was a Codespaces skeptic before this started and now I am not. This is the way. ~@iolsen I don't actually doubt that this (and the 4 other glowing employee quotes) are real, but even assuming they are, I can understand people remaining skeptical about the sample size of 5 being broadly representative of the 100s (1000s?) of engineers at the company. Also slightly hilarious that "T…

I think people like not having their physical machine tied to their dev environment. IMO "the way" to do this is with ssh and tmux, not a web app. As long as people have choices I guess it doesn't matter.

> I think people like not having their physical machine tied to their dev environment.

I'm curious to know if this statement is true. Most experienced developers these days have a regular desk and a chair where they like to code and focus. How prevalent is the move-and-code scenario?

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#426

Post by politelemon »

bogwog wrote: post #358

Serious question: if I were to use this, would Microsoft collect analytics on me (code written, keystrokes, mouse movements, sleep/work schedule, productivity metrics, etc) and monetize that data by using it to build some AI product like Copilot, or build a productivity dashboard so managers can fire people for not being productive enough (like Xsolla did), use it to serve me ads, or do some stupid/irresponsible/unet…

Context is hugely important, and equally important is not to get sucked in by the HN echo chamber - that is, consider the MS of _now_ as opposed to that of 15 years ago which HN likes to bash (and give a free pass to other companies doing nefarious things). The FB example is considering the FB of _now_ and not 15 years ago.

In terms of the biggest companies in the sector, MS has been doing much more for developers and developer productivity than others. At the same time it's not a monolith and so you should not expect boyscout behavior either.

Privacy is a concern, and the onus is on you the user to ensure that you remain in control of your data. When using a service (any service), the answer is to always be ready to bail at a moment's notice. That means using source control and not tying yourself to a specific ecosystem.

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#428

Post by codezero »

tempfs wrote: post #78
ionwake wrote: post #40

Just a couple of years ago some kid gained access to every repo on github. Now githubs code is going to be developed on an online platform, which works by sharing code others have uploaded. I have a feeling that this is not a good recipe.

Microsoft owns Github now. There is only really one way things will go from that point.

Are you suggesting this will be available on Xbox?

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#429

Post by MichaelRust »

bogwog wrote: post #358

Serious question: if I were to use this, would Microsoft collect analytics on me (code written, keystrokes, mouse movements, sleep/work schedule, productivity metrics, etc) and monetize that data by using it to build some AI product like Copilot, or build a productivity dashboard so managers can fire people for not being productive enough (like Xsolla did), use it to serve me ads, or do some stupid/irresponsible/unet…

You think? I'm just completely drained and I want Microsoft, Google, Apple, Facebook, to get off my lawn.

https://rentry.co/areweweloveopensauceyet

Re: GitHub’s engineering team has moved to Codespaces

#430

Post by tshaddox »

donny2018 wrote: post #390
SamuelAdams wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Businesses can both charge money for a service and sell / analyze user data. The two aren’t mutually exclusive.

I agree. But as a rule of thumb, if someone gives you the service for free, they have no choice but to collect value from you by other means. Whereas when you pay money for the service, the business does have a choice not to sell your data. Either way, I guess we need to read the terms to be sure.

If a company has a certain type of investors or shareholders, they may have no choice but to collect value from you all means possible regardless of how much value they are already collecting.
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