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Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

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Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#331

Post by dougmwne »

p_l wrote: post #301
kolinko wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Half of Polish cities were rebuilt using central urban planning and came up awesome (build quality aside). There were a few rules: - 5-10 min walk to kindergarden/school and local stores - 3-5 min walk to a bus stop - tons of green space - taller buildings but varied in size and angles so that there is both ample space and variety This is my place I lived in when studying: https://goo.gl/maps/VQqNEY8rcjScsGFg6 (not e…

And a lot of old issues about how drab they were are due to how long it took for the green areas to flourish properly after the building spree. These days it's much easier to "kickstart" the green areas.

I have also been seeing more mural art put up on these old tower blocks buildings. A giant blank wall is only ugly if you have no imagination.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#332

Post by andrepd »

raffraffraff wrote: post #311
stemlord wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ive seen several attempts at master planned neighborhoods with little town center type things with the idea that youd rarely have to leave, around South Florida growing up, and even lived in one for a few years. They all failed miserably. I feel like ones that succeed are just lucky. These communities can have basic predetermined guidelines to how growth can happen but the actual growth needs to happen organically. Y…

Better than no planning. I live in a part of Dublin (Ireland) that was rapidly developed back in the 1950s to house families that were being rehomed from condemned tenement buildings in the city. The design came from "garden cities", a design from England in the early 1900s. It wasn't very "organic". Entire housing estates were built. These were modest family homes with gardens, and the estates included ample green s…

Same thing in the UK, council housing was high-quality and affordable for new families. Blame Thatcher for selling off council housing (amid her many disastrous policies).

It's amazing how many problems in the UK and the US today can be traced back to Thatcher and Reagan respectively.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#333

Post by hellotomyrars »

caslon wrote: post #145
harikb wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Planning works great for public utilities- roads, libraries, parks etc. The moment we cross that are have a planned bank, grocer, retail I think it falls apart. The grocery shop needs guarantee on revenue to be setup, and then they will slack off because they won’t need to compete or innovate. People will realize once the HOA bill runs in to several hundred dollars and have to deal with shitty services. In the real w…

Alternatively in the real world, one grocery store will die because a Wal*Mart opened an hour away and is replaced by an hour's drive instead of a brief walk to pick up groceries because people can't resist a dollar cheaper and ten more in gas.

I find this pretty insulting to the average persons intelligence and out of touch with the pricing realities in many locations.

I have two local grocery stores. One is in town and the other the next over. Both are less than 3 miles. The prices are between 2-4x compared to me driving 30 miles in either direction to visit Cost Co/Walmart.

I don’t mind paying more for local or the convenience but I quite literally can’t afford to more than double my grocery budget for the month. So I only buy perishables locally for the most part.

The economics of this are problematic in both directions, but I still need to put food on the table.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#334

Post by brnt »

stefanve wrote: post #292
brnt wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

99.99% of the Netherlands is planned construction, we seem to be doing allright.

while that is true, a lot of the house are for sale and people will make small changes. Also local governments ask for input from the people that live there. Shops can come and go as these are mostly rentel spaces. So while we do a lot of planning there is still room to make it your own. This village seems to be a Holliday park like experience. With only rentals and pre defined shops

That sounds like overplanning. I guess in the US for some reason people are not looking for a middle ground?

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#335

Post by batoure »

slg wrote: post #54
jrsdav wrote: post #18

I live in a master planned community (Daybreak, Utah), and while you can definitely scoff at the building quality (state of things everywhere right now, it's all done fast and with low quality materials), it's been fantastic, especially during the pandemic. The whole neighborhood is designed to be walkable, with parks, pools, trails, train stations, grocery stores and restaurants (added in the later phases, which are…

For sake of comparison, Wikipedia says Daybreak is over 4000 acres while Culdesac is 16. These projects aren't close in scale and I think the "neighborhood" in the marketing for Culdesac is misleading regarding what life would actually be like living there. There are several individual buildings in my neighborhood that house more people and I still need a car on a regular basis.

Agreed on some digging Culdesac is very clearly just a “rebranded apartment complex” their units are only for rent nothing like a stand alone house is available and as far as the retailers/restaurants the ones listed will occupy the only spaces built for that purpose… its an apartment complex

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#336

Post by helen___keller »

Thorentis wrote: post #103

Unfortunately this project lacks two things which are essential to a long-lasting, sustainable, and human-friendly town. 1) Architecture that inspires, elevates the soul, and will last the test of time. All I see is soulless pre-fabs. It looks like you're living in a shopping mall. 2) The freedom to create buildings and institutions that are meaningful to the residents who reside there. Churches, schools, sporting cl…

I agree with (2) more than (1) because if you have (2) then you're free to replace a soulless building you don't like, so the architecture of the region will mature and diversify over time.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#337

Post by p_l »

dougmwne wrote: post #331
p_l wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And a lot of old issues about how drab they were are due to how long it took for the green areas to flourish properly after the building spree. These days it's much easier to "kickstart" the green areas.

I have also been seeing more mural art put up on these old tower blocks buildings. A giant blank wall is only ugly if you have no imagination.

Indeed, in the places that lacked decoration it's nice to see them added.

A bit of a problem however is when original detailing gets removed on n the estates that did have it, often replaced with cheap pastel Styrofoam insulation.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#338

Post by ClumsyPilot »

xyzzyz wrote: post #233
dragontamer wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The shared makerspace seems like a neighborhood level thing. There's all sorts of services / hobbies that make more sense to be neighborhood based instead of nationally based. Tools and workshops are like that. The biggest issue with tools/workshops is liability. Someone's going to lose a finger, or a rotary tool will pull out their hair / a piece of their scalp... (even with all the safety precautions, its going to…

Liability is not a problem. If people get hurt using tools, it’s almost always either entirely their fault, or some rare and random case of very bad luck. Either way, you can have people sign 50 liability waivers before allowing them to touch anything, and buy liability insurance (paid for by member fees). No, the real problem is not idiots hurting themselves, but rather them hurting tools. Many tools are easy to dam…

"No, the real problem is not idiots hurting themselves, but rather them hurting tools'

Thats cold, and peak Havkernews. People here are by definition not proffeshional. I made quite a few mistakes and was lucky to get away unscathed.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#339

Post by michaelt »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #288
kolinko wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Walkable neighborhoods don’t need to be small, and they can have car traffic - it’s more about how you design that car traffic. This is a main corner and main street in neighborhood near my home place. It has car traffic, but it is perfectly walkable. The main street has ground floor dedicated to commerce. https://goo.gl/maps/W46KUsJtAtto2yUE7 You have a bus stop with buses getting to city center every 3-5 min, and t…

The post I was responding to suggested that it wasn't necessary to arrange for at least one grocery store in the walkable neighborhood, and that leasing to retail establishments could be entirely up to the building owners. I was observing that if that results in no grocery stores located in the neighborhood, that would make the neighborhood much less walkable. (Even if there's one in walking distance, hopefully it ha…

> And unless you want to go out for groceries far too often

I know carless Londoners whose commute takes them past a grocery store on foot every day. So they will literally go into the store for a single item.

However, you're right that this isn't a good solution for everyone - for example, people who are starting a family. Even if you can fit a week's groceries for one person into a backpack, that's no help for four-person households. Grocery delivery services are widely used in London for this reason. As is moving out of the city in order to start a family.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#340

Post by vmception »

jrsdav wrote: post #18

I live in a master planned community (Daybreak, Utah), and while you can definitely scoff at the building quality (state of things everywhere right now, it's all done fast and with low quality materials), it's been fantastic, especially during the pandemic. The whole neighborhood is designed to be walkable, with parks, pools, trails, train stations, grocery stores and restaurants (added in the later phases, which are…

Sad the name is Culdesac though

Immediately triggers the idea of empty soulless suburban community dead ends that are the opposite of walkable

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