Default disappearing messages • Hacker News Board

Re: Default disappearing messages

#11

Post by DaiPlusPlus » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:38 AM UTC

jillesvangurp wrote: post #7

I've been in a few slack communities that were on the freemium plan. On that plan, older messages become in-accessible if you don't pay. They don't get deleted of course: you will get them back if you switch to a paid plan. But in practice that seems to be rarely interesting. Chat is all about what happened recently and not about what happened weeks/months ago. Ephemeral messages are a good default.

> They don't get deleted of course: you will get them back if you switch to a paid plan.

I'm curious what the legality of that is under the GDPR and other preceding data-protection regs...

If you're using Slack in a personal capacity, then don't you have the legal right to demand an archive of your messages without paying them anything?

Re: Default disappearing messages

#12

Post by cmwelsh » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:38 AM UTC

The main thing that I dislike about disappearing messages is that there’s an obnoxious clock and username next to each and every message, even if you write two in quick succession. It really breaks up the flow of the chat when someone is having a stream of consciousness moment.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#13

Post by boondaburrah » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:38 AM UTC

jraph wrote: post #10

colesantiago wrote: post #2

Although a welcome addition to Signal, personally would like to see the 'phone number sign up' 'disappear' from the app and instead add email signup. Thats all.

Yes. Or, at the very least, support people who have a phone that is not Android or iOS by allowing them to register from a desktop application. Does not seem misaligned with Signal's aim for privacy.

One of the things I've noticed is that Signal doesn't seem to care about privacy at all. They care a lot about security though, which is a different thing, and tell you that's privacy.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#14

Post by pmlnr » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:42 AM UTC

colesantiago wrote: post #2

Although a welcome addition to Signal, personally would like to see the 'phone number sign up' 'disappear' from the app and instead add email signup. Thats all.

That is called XMPP.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#15

Post by andy_ppp » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:46 AM UTC

We have seen the UK government magically lose phones and supposedly WhatsApp messages where we all presume illegal business was being done that financially benefits those involved. I think we need a blockchain version of messaging the does the opposite and using anything like this for government communication should have mandatory 5 year sentences attached.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#16

Post by blfr » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:47 AM UTC

I'm more worried about appearing than disappearing messages and wish there was a spoiler/nsfw tag for them so that recipient's device only displays messages (and especially attached images) after a tap or some other deliberate action. Right now there are a few people I need to take a pause to think if I want to open that conversation with others around.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#17

Post by a_t48 » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:55 AM UTC

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #11

jillesvangurp wrote: post #7

I've been in a few slack communities that were on the freemium plan. On that plan, older messages become in-accessible if you don't pay. They don't get deleted of course: you will get them back if you switch to a paid plan. But in practice that seems to be rarely interesting. Chat is all about what happened recently and not about what happened weeks/months ago. Ephemeral messages are a good default.

> They don't get deleted of course: you will get them back if you switch to a paid plan. I'm curious what the legality of that is under the GDPR and other preceding data-protection regs... If you're using Slack in a personal capacity, then don't you have the legal right to demand an archive of your messages without paying them anything?

You actually can, without paying. Just use the export button. The restriction is on search and display in the UI.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#18

Post by afiori » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:56 AM UTC

vertis wrote: post #6

colesantiago wrote: post #2

Although a welcome addition to Signal, personally would like to see the 'phone number sign up' 'disappear' from the app and instead add email signup. Thats all.

This is one of the biggest things that stops me from using Signal. I don't have a phone number really any more (I'm a digital nomad, and pick up regional sims) I'm not really interested in the disappearing message either if I wanted that I could just use Slack Free edition :troll:. In all seriousness though, my messages are part of my memory. They're shared experience with my partner and a record of decisions. I unde…

> In all seriousness though, my messages are part of my memory. They're shared experience with my partner and a record of decisions.

Thanks for saying this, I moved to Telegram[1] before I had a chance to learn about/suffer from Whatsapp take on backups, but it would have been devastating to lose years of messages with people over a bricked phone.

[1] I know Telegram has a bad rep due to their home cooked crypto and maybe other stuff, but I like the app, I vaguely trust the author, and it works fine for me.

Re: Default disappearing messages

#19

Post by beermonster » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:56 AM UTC

boondaburrah wrote: post #13

jraph wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Or, at the very least, support people who have a phone that is not Android or iOS by allowing them to register from a desktop application. Does not seem misaligned with Signal's aim for privacy.

One of the things I've noticed is that Signal doesn't seem to care about privacy at all. They care a lot about security though, which is a different thing, and tell you that's privacy.

See Best WhatsApp alternatives that respect your privacy[1]. Signal has:

Pros

    Free
    Very good encryption
    Almost no metadata kept
    Protocol independently audited
    Seamless to use on Android
    Disappearing messages
    E2EE text, voice, and video group chat

Cons

    Requires a valid phone number to register
    Hosted on Amazon Web Services (AWS)

[1] https://protonmail.com/blog/whatsapp-alternatives/

Re: Default disappearing messages

#20

Post by pwdisswordfish8 » Wed, Aug 11, 2021, 6:57 AM UTC

Rd6n6 wrote: post #3

The max timer is too short. 6 months would be a convenient value - enough time to reference the messages while they might be relevant, but also not floating around forever

> The max timer is too short

Short enough to hopefully nudge people into immediately writing the whole thing off as a terrible idea and then choosing not to enable it.

Apparently dumb shit like this is what Moxie had in mind when he wrote the infamous blog post about why disallowing personal (patched) builds and third party clients gives them the advantage of being able to control the user experience in a way that they wouldn't be able to if people were using an unsanctioned client.