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The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

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41–50 of 264 posts

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#41

> To engage workers, managers must fulfill the 12 essential elements of engagement Hm. There are few jobs that can become life goals, most are boring. And with a years long pandemic and uncertain future, to work or not to work? Work for what purpose? No level of engaging is enough if people can see through the ruse. If anything i d expect more people to go solo

I feel like if you sacrifice enough in wages you can always have a fascinating job. And moving to a developing country can leave you with a roughly equivalent salary after adjusting for purchasing powe parity. I don't have hard data but that's what I've been doing for the last four years.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#42
post #22

I resigned during the pandemic. The lockdown stripped my job to the essentials: No colleagues, no coffee corner, no nice fancy office, no treats (lunches, dinners, drinks), brainstorms, etc. I was left with something that was boring me to death. I felt perfectly happy in that job for 5 years before covid.

It’s interesting how different people are. All those things you list are reasons I would want to quit a job. I don’t ever want to work in an office ever again.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#43

I can’t imagine why people might be discontent… All that’s really being asked of us is to give up all our productive years in service to people with no ethics, to make them richer. People who are more than happy to use you up and toss your corpse on the pile when you die. Is that really too much? How dare you think you deserve something for your toils. Your masters have worked you incredibly hard — harder than you th…

This is a consequence on a shift in society's values and culture: https://m-g-h.medium.com/why-we-are-dispensable-7a577eba4f3e

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#44

I can’t imagine why people might be discontent… All that’s really being asked of us is to give up all our productive years in service to people with no ethics, to make them richer. People who are more than happy to use you up and toss your corpse on the pile when you die. Is that really too much? How dare you think you deserve something for your toils. Your masters have worked you incredibly hard — harder than you th…

Sorry, but what's the alternative exactly? Force people who do actually work, produce, create, etc to pay for people who think working is beneath them? Should you be given free shit simply because you exist?

If you don't want to work for someone else, then start a business. If you don't want to work at all, then figure out how you're going to live. No one is forcing you to do anything.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN is very much against the whole anti-work movement and still likes to push a bootstraps narrative as a collective. It makes sense when you think of what Y Combinator is and the kinds of people it attracts.

What are you suggesting as an alternative? Less economic opportunity?

Just that there is a future where those who don’t want to work a menial job aren’t forced to do so in order to survive. Which may mean accepting a lower level of productivity. But a lot of people get bored without work, and extra money to buy nice things will always motivate people, so there will still be a large labor pool and automation can take care of the rest.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#46
post #14

> $9,000 a year to keep each disengaged worker and between $25,000 and $100,000 to replace them. Given how job tenure has plummeted over the years, I have a hard time believing this is accurate. Does anyone know a place where retention efforts come anywhere close to hiring efforts?

For employers it's game theory. If employees are commodities then it's better to keep the pay structure and have X amount of attrition than to pay everyone more to keep attrition low.

I think I finally figured part of this out. Like you said, employers treat workers as commodities. This worked out great for them in the short term, as they saved money by not giving raises etc. In the long term, though, workers started realizing they often had to go back to the market to get meaningful pay raises. Now you have a situation where workers are switching as often as every 12-24 months, and the thing not previously accounted for is onboarding costs. In a situation where workers stay an average of 5 years, let's say they take a year to become net productive, you're losing about 20% of their time as an investment for 80% payoff. Now, though, that static year of onboarding costs accounts for 50-65% of their entire tenure. That's a huge swing against companies, who are suddenly realizing retention might be a problem. So the economic/management theory that everyone is just an interchangeable commodity is running up against the wall of reality, where second-order effects have taken over and destroyed a bunch of business value that could be captured in a more stable environment.

There's an additional problem that firms are caught in a game theoretic trap. If you're the only firm providing stability, your investments in that in the short term might make you less competitive on pay, which means you'll train up people who might leave seeing higher pay elsewhere. So stability investments might be rational in the long term, but because of market conditions you get killed in the short term, and you end up tempted to abandon your strategy after a few bad quarters where it looks like they aren't paying off.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#47
post #5

> To engage workers, managers must fulfill the 12 essential elements of engagement Hm. There are few jobs that can become life goals, most are boring. And with a years long pandemic and uncertain future, to work or not to work? Work for what purpose? No level of engaging is enough if people can see through the ruse. If anything i d expect more people to go solo

> There are few jobs that can become life goals, most are boring. That's because the big tech megacorps raised the bar in order to attract the best workers available so they could grow to have the "eliteness" that you see today. The problem is, there are only so many Apples or Netflixes with this kind of strategy so everything else looks boring in comparison.

I wouldn’t expect a job at Netflix or Apple to be much more exciting than most other jobs. I thought they were attractive workplaces because of pay, perks, and because it looks good on your CV.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#48
Pay me well, provide good benefits, allow a flexible work schedule where I can work when I want to and still get day to day life stuff done and hire enough people so I can consistently work only the 40 hours you are actually paying me for. My current job does that and I love it. When something critical comes up I'm happy to work over a weekend to hit a deadline because I know my manager will comp me back time when I need it.

The thing that's always burned me out at work is letting people on my team go through attrition or layoffs and expecting the rest of us to pick up all the slack like it didn't take 3 other people to do it.

It's frankly a pretty simple formula.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#49

I can’t imagine why people might be discontent… All that’s really being asked of us is to give up all our productive years in service to people with no ethics, to make them richer. People who are more than happy to use you up and toss your corpse on the pile when you die. Is that really too much? How dare you think you deserve something for your toils. Your masters have worked you incredibly hard — harder than you th…

Honestly, this sentiment is valid for most of the working class. But in our industry, it's not the majority of cases. I feel well compensated and not overworked. Now, is my work fulfilling? No.

How can we determine what the percentage is? I'm also in your boat in feeling well compensated and not overworked, but I anecdotally feel like I'm very fortunate in this regard despite what I thought was the norm.

Re: The 'Great Resignation' is really the 'Great Discontent'

#50
post #22

I resigned during the pandemic. The lockdown stripped my job to the essentials: No colleagues, no coffee corner, no nice fancy office, no treats (lunches, dinners, drinks), brainstorms, etc. I was left with something that was boring me to death. I felt perfectly happy in that job for 5 years before covid.

It’s interesting how different people are. All those things you list are reasons I would want to quit a job. I don’t ever want to work in an office ever again.

Indeed. Besides the free food, those are the less desirable parts of work to me.
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