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New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

npr.org

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Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#31

Post by IntrepidWorm »

gautamcgoel wrote: post #27

The article mentioned that they began to suspect the plant was carnivorous when they noticed it was missing a specific gene. I'd be curious to know what that gene is, and why it's linked to carnivorous plants.

Not a geneticist or a botanist here, but I would assume that because it is carnivorous, it gains a particular set of nutrients from the fruit flies and thus does not need to absorb these compounds through the root system. The gene or set of genes responsible for processing nutrients through the root would thus not be needed and would eventually be deactivated or disappear entirely over the evolution of the species.

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#32

Post by a-dub »

did anybody ask the plant if it was okay with its genes being sequenced?!

isn't this, like, what we all have feared regarding genomic data falling into the government's hands?

people paid by the government stole this poor innocent plant's genomes and then ran it through their fancy machines that claimed dubious statistical similarity with the genes of murderers, then...

people paid by the government then showed up, radioinfused some fruitflies, stuck them on this poor innocent plant, denied it food and water, waited for the flies to die and decompose, dug up traces in the plant and then declared it a MURDERER for fame and fortune.

this is way scarier than apple checking hashes of images to see if they're evidence of exploitation of children in their icloud photo uploader... wake up sheeple!!!

VEGETABLE RIGHTS AND PEACE

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#33

Post by ajkjk »

mmaunder wrote: post #28

Interesting that they started with data. Some of the most interesting discoveries I've made have started with me saying "that's weird" while looking at data. From the article: "Graham's team was doing an unrelated project on plant genetics and noticed that the western false asphodel had a genetic deletion that's sometimes seen in carnivorous plants. The researchers started to think about the fact that this flower gre…

I've long felt that the American school system's version of the scientific method (formulate hypothesis, run experiment, collect data, draw conclusions) is totally wrong and turns people off of science.

The real procedure that we should teach kids is: collect data, ask questions about it, hypothesize some answers, and only then do a experiment to test your theory. The question formulation, based on observational evidence, is where all of the interesting science really happens.

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#34

Post by icelancer »

ajkjk wrote: post #33
mmaunder wrote: post #28

Interesting that they started with data. Some of the most interesting discoveries I've made have started with me saying "that's weird" while looking at data. From the article: "Graham's team was doing an unrelated project on plant genetics and noticed that the western false asphodel had a genetic deletion that's sometimes seen in carnivorous plants. The researchers started to think about the fact that this flower gre…

I've long felt that the American school system's version of the scientific method (formulate hypothesis, run experiment, collect data, draw conclusions) is totally wrong and turns people off of science. The real procedure that we should teach kids is: collect data, ask questions about it, hypothesize some answers, and only then do a experiment to test your theory. The question formulation, based on observational evid…

Both lead to common biases - the former in fraudulent experimentation, the latter (your suggestion) in fraudulent data snooping and anecdotal case-finding. Both have their merits done correctly, however, but the latter is only possible because of the former - the data has to come from somewhere, and experimentation was how it was historically done... since there wasn't a global database upon instantiation of the planet.

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#35

Post by floatingatoll »

ajkjk wrote: post #33
mmaunder wrote: post #28

Interesting that they started with data. Some of the most interesting discoveries I've made have started with me saying "that's weird" while looking at data. From the article: "Graham's team was doing an unrelated project on plant genetics and noticed that the western false asphodel had a genetic deletion that's sometimes seen in carnivorous plants. The researchers started to think about the fact that this flower gre…

I've long felt that the American school system's version of the scientific method (formulate hypothesis, run experiment, collect data, draw conclusions) is totally wrong and turns people off of science. The real procedure that we should teach kids is: collect data, ask questions about it, hypothesize some answers, and only then do a experiment to test your theory. The question formulation, based on observational evid…

This model is especially valuable when paired with a teacher who can mentor the students in expanding the horizons of kids during the "ask questions about it" step, because you'll end up with a class full of people who reflexively cross-pollinate problems and solutions across multiple domains.

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#37

Post by diegs »

icelancer wrote: post #34
ajkjk wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've long felt that the American school system's version of the scientific method (formulate hypothesis, run experiment, collect data, draw conclusions) is totally wrong and turns people off of science. The real procedure that we should teach kids is: collect data, ask questions about it, hypothesize some answers, and only then do a experiment to test your theory. The question formulation, based on observational evid…

Both lead to common biases - the former in fraudulent experimentation, the latter (your suggestion) in fraudulent data snooping and anecdotal case-finding. Both have their merits done correctly, however, but the latter is only possible because of the former - the data has to come from somewhere, and experimentation was how it was historically done... since there wasn't a global database upon instantiation of the plan…

IANAPOSE (I am not a philosophy of science expert) but I think a happy medium is to observe, collect data, and look for things that are interesting, and then perform properly formulate experiments to test those hypotheses.

I think that focusing on either side alone can lead to biases and problematic science, and focusing on both is actually the most "fun"

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#38

Post by tantalor »

Quikinterp wrote: post #22

I like the technique of testing if it was carnivorous. For the lazy people, they put a nitrogen isotope inside fruitflies and then tested the plant later to see if it was absorbing the nitrogen, and it was.

This sounds like an incomplete test. What was the control? Did they try sticking fruit flies to the stems of known non-carnivore plant?

Re: New carnivorous plant discovered in Pacific Northwest

#40

Post by dekhn »

scardycat wrote: post #2

What an interesting find! The biodiversity of our home planet is amazing. If you enjoy learning more about carnivorous plants, I highly recommend 'Plants Behaving Badly' on PBS[1]. 1. https://www.pbs.org/show/plants-behaving-badly/

I used to work in a building with a drosophila fly lab. From time to time, I'd visit the lab, use CO2 gas to knock a fly out, and then place it in my venus fly trap (you have to flick the little hairs in the trap a couple times to get it to close). The fly wakes up, and since it's alive and jiggling, the trap stays shut. About a month little the trap opens again, and a little husk of dessicated fly drops out. Afterwars, the plant grows nicely
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