Earlier quoted context omitted.
If Apple is indeed using CNNs, then I don’t see why any of the black-box adversarial attacks used today in ML wouldn’t work. It seems way easier than attacking file hashes, since there are many images in the image space that are viable (e.g., sending a photo of random noise to troll with such an attack seems passable).
What's a CNN?
The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
431–440 of 440 posts
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#432Earlier quoted context omitted.
But you cannot know that a-priori so it’s either an attack vector for image manipulation or straight up false positives. Assume we had this perfect hash knowledge. I’d create a compression algorithm to uniquely map between images and the 256 bit hash space, which we probably agree is similarly improbable. It’s on the order of 1000x to 10000x more efficient than JPEG and isn’t even lossy.
You’re going to have to explain that—what is an attack vector for image manipulation? What is an attack vector for false positives? > Assume we had this perfect hash knowledge. It’s not a perfect hash. Nobody’s saying it’s a perfect hash. It’s not. It’s a perceptual hash. It is specifically designed to map similar images to similar hashes, for the “right” notion of similar.
The hashing isn’t really so relevant apart from pigeonhole arguments. It’s a machine learning problem of classification between CP and not, and hashing is an implementation detail. The way I would attack this reading a few papers would be to approximate any non-differentiable parts of the hashing with a smooth proxy function, then use an off-the-shelf gradient-based attack such as Fast Sign Gradient Method. The hashing guarantees that even at hashing distance 0, you have a huge amount of collisions, so that is blind spot 1. Blind spot 2 is the CNN is not-robust to mild-perturbations, so you can “squeeze” inputs together in hash space by modifying them. You can likely attack both simultaneously by doing the attack I said above.
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#433Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don’t have to believe him; it’s clear on the face of it. Trump often spoke directly to the voters on Twitter and Youtube. That’s gone now.
Trump can still speak directly to the voters who are interested. It turns out not very many are interested. E.g.: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/02/trump-blog-page-shuts-down-f... Even Fox has stopped running his events: https://deadline.com/2021/06/donald-trump-rally-networks-ski... The largest pro-Trump network has seen major declines in ratings: https://www.thewrap.com/newsmax-fox-news-six-months-ratings/
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#434Earlier quoted context omitted.
One way this hair-brained Apple program could end is to constantly generate an abundance of false positives, and try to render it useless. For those old enough to remember “Jam Echelon Day”, maybe it won’t have any effect. But what other recourse do we have other than to maliciously and intentionally subvert and break it?
What recourse? how about not buying apple devices that have always locked the user into a golden cage?
In the same way I was naive to believe Apple was different from others and cared about user privacy.
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#435Earlier quoted context omitted.
what function does the word "even" perform in this sentence?
It's used to emphasize the concept that if anyone would have nudes of my wife, it would be me, her husband. Here's another example of "even" used as an emphasizing word. >I don't know how to answer that. >Even I don't know how to answer that. Hope that helps you with your ESL tests!
If I wanted to emphasize, I would write "I don't even know how to answer that".
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#436Earlier quoted context omitted.
FYI Illiberal values aka non-liberal values (clarifying because the I is hard to read) use the word liberal in the traditional sense. Liberal values are liberty/freedom, consent of the governed, and equality before the law. All other liberal values build off of these three as a base. This implies that Non-liberal (or illiberal) values are the opposition of liberal values through censorship, gun control, etc like you…
Karl Marx quote on the right to keep and bear arms only applies to the proletariat. If you are a programmer and own the means of production (your laptop), you are not proletariat. All socialist and communist countries have strict gun control.
If you own the means of production and receive the full fruits of your labour, you are part of the bourgeoisie.
Self employed programmers are bourgeoisie, employed ones are not. And of those that are part of the bourgeoisie, there are levels and not all of them are bad (even in the scope of socialist theory).
- The petite bourgeoisie are your small self employed shopkeepers, artisans, and tradesmen. These are the people who live by their own means and without exploiting anyone else's labour. Rising the proletariat to this level is the entire point of socialism.
- The moyenne bourgeoisie maintain largely the same lifestyle as the petite bourgeoisie but with strong financial establishment. They are effectively the upper end of the petite bourgeoisie and whether they are considered part of the problem or part of the end goal depends almost entirely on whether they are supported solely by their own labour or if they are unduly exploiting the labour of others. This class may lend money in some capacity however normally if they are doing so, they are doing it collectively.
- The grand bourgeoisie are largely where the problems with the bourgeoisie begin. These people have an established financial status from a few generations of wealth. This class is the one running larger businesses and their wealth is almost entirely derived from the work of others rather than their own.
- The haute bourgeoisie are the "true" bourgeoisie. You can only make it to this class through generations of wealth aggregation (unless you ride an industrial revolution) and once you are here, it is almost impossible to lose your financial status regardless of spending or financial failings. These are the eternally rich and their existence is only sustained by exploiting the labour of others.
Socialist theory considers the petite and moyenne bourgeoisie to be the "end goal" for society. They are nearly entirely sustained by their own labour and may use their excess funds to invest in the community (normally with some expectation of return but not any life sustaining amount). Marx warned that through the natural progression of capitalist society, these classes (primarily the petite but also the moyenne in some capacity) would wither while the wealth collected in the hands of the grand and haute bourgeoisie.
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Additionally, many socialist and communist nations have strict gun control not because they are socialist or communist, but because they are authoritarian. Gun control is a sign of authoritarianism more than anything else and any nation that falls towards it is going to see the population disarmed.
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#437Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've had my bag sniffed at airports at least 50 times, and they've never stopped me. So there must be something else going on as well
Airport dogs (at least in the baggage claim area) are not sniffing for drugs. They alert on food products that aren’t allowed.
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#438Earlier quoted context omitted.
Trump can still speak directly to the voters who are interested. It turns out not very many are interested. E.g.: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/02/trump-blog-page-shuts-down-f... Even Fox has stopped running his events: https://deadline.com/2021/06/donald-trump-rally-networks-ski... The largest pro-Trump network has seen major declines in ratings: https://www.thewrap.com/newsmax-fox-news-six-months-ratings/
It’s much harder now because he’s been effectively banned from every relevant “public square”.
Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#439Re: The Problem with Perceptual Hashes
#440Earlier quoted context omitted.
You’re going to have to explain that—what is an attack vector for image manipulation? What is an attack vector for false positives? > Assume we had this perfect hash knowledge. It’s not a perfect hash. Nobody’s saying it’s a perfect hash. It’s not. It’s a perceptual hash. It is specifically designed to map similar images to similar hashes, for the “right” notion of similar.
It’s an attack vector because, either directly or indirectly, people will get access to the hash function. Therefore, they will have a testbed to launch attacks against the hash. Once they learn an attack, they will hash your harmless pictures into being classified as CP by applying a potentially perceptually invisible modification to your images. Imagine every image on reddit’s frontpage being classified as CP. The…