About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years • Hacker News Board

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#61

Post by ransom1538 » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:05 AM UTC

mumblemumble wrote: post #20

chadcmulligan wrote: post #2

It's like all those jobs - game developer, film jobs, graphic artist, artist, musician - too many young people want to do it and there's a lot of money if you're successful so it attracts sharks up the top who keep all the money. Just don't is my advice, unless you have a trust fund, which a large number of those successful have, you can weather out the early years then until you make a name for yourself.

I'm rather fond of the story of the Pulitzer prizewinning poet Wallace Stevens, who worked as an insurance attorney by day, and did his writing during his free time. He considered his unexciting day job to be something that enabled him to do his writing, by giving his life a stable foundation that left plenty of mental resources remaining for doing what he loved. Some choice quotes on the subject: "It is necessary to…

Jay Leno hates doing comedy. Once he quit, he got to spend 100% of his time on his passion: cars.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#62

Post by willjp » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:12 AM UTC

nerdbaggy wrote: post #46

alspacka wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m an animator and the complex jobs == production hell. Every facet of the industry is a race to the bottom, just a matter of how insulated you are from it. Luckily I’m in medical animation where things move a little more slowly

Is it true that for TV shows a lot of the actual animation team is outsourced to countries with low income?

It depends on the production. I think this was especially true on US/CA productions while everything was predominantly hand drawn in the 80s/90s. You'd have key-frame animators that laid out the actions, and in betweening would be outsourced. I'm sure it is still done now, especially for TV where the budget is tighter. It's a tricky business, I empathize with owners that want to make the situation better but need to compete on bids, and employees (if that) having difficulty making rent on the frames they can get approved. Like with code, you have to love it to stick with it.

I have no idea what it's like for anime. This is subjective - but I think the quality is usually much higher. I'm not sure how it is done.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#63

Post by toast0 » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:12 AM UTC

nerdbaggy wrote: post #46

alspacka wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m an animator and the complex jobs == production hell. Every facet of the industry is a race to the bottom, just a matter of how insulated you are from it. Luckily I’m in medical animation where things move a little more slowly

Is it true that for TV shows a lot of the actual animation team is outsourced to countries with low income?

Watch the credits (which is hard for modern TV, but not so hard for movies). When you see hundreds of people listed under animation and 99% of them have names associated with one culture and that culture's home region is low income, chances are it was outsourced to that region.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#64

Post by nitrogen » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:13 AM UTC

neovive wrote: post #43

setr wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SysAdmins fit this bill, but I know them as having a pretty terrible social position — no one cares about you until something goes wrong, and then they’re pissed at you. Fix it, and go back to your dungeon.

I've worked in IT support for many years and this generally comes with the territory. Although some users/customers value your contributions and are very grateful, the majority unfortunately view IT as dial-tone service; only interacting with IT when something "doesn't work for them." As an IT professional, patience is highly-valuable skill.

In addition to just really liking the IT people at some of the places where I've worked, I've found that the people who are hostile are really shooting themselves in the foot when they do need help. Making friends across all departments goes a really long way, and there are cool people in most every walk of life.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#65

Post by sslayer » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:14 AM UTC

nerdbaggy wrote: post #46

alspacka wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m an animator and the complex jobs == production hell. Every facet of the industry is a race to the bottom, just a matter of how insulated you are from it. Luckily I’m in medical animation where things move a little more slowly

Is it true that for TV shows a lot of the actual animation team is outsourced to countries with low income?

If it can be outsourced, it will be outsourced. It an absolute race to the bottom shitshow

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#66

Post by nitrogen » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:16 AM UTC

tharkun__ wrote: post #44

afavour wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no way that being a game developer does not sound interesting and complex. I say this as someone that doesn’t even play many games! But it’s something almost everyone has a point of reference for and has (hopefully?) enjoyed at some point in the past.

I would say it depends. Never say never. Personally mortgage software sounds complex but boring to me. Game developer sounded interesting and complex before I knew more about it. Now it's more boring as in after knowing the death march culture I don't want to know more. I guess your parent meant that too by 'boring'. If you work for yourself or with like minded indie developers that sounds more interesting to me. It…

Having also worked on mortgage software, there are ways to "sell" it -- the people your software helps are getting homes when they might not otherwise have been able. That's pretty exciting for them.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#67

Post by yodon » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:27 AM UTC

actually_a_dog wrote: post #53

dagmx wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neither Technical Director or Lighting Director are roles that would naturally progress from being an animator.

Neither does “product/project manager” progress naturally from “software engineer,” but it’s a moderately common progression in the real world.

I suspect the comment came from someone who was confusing "people who work in animation" with "people who are Animators." I have known a great many Technical Directors who wanted to be Animators. I have known only one Animator who wanted to be a Technical Director, and he faced no significant obstacles in transitioning to become one.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#68

Post by ClemFandango » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:39 AM UTC

Is nobody going to address the series of elephants in the room here? Even the embedded video in the article didn't say anything about it, and the author's proposed and current solution is more or less a social band-aid. These animators need to unionise, or demand full-time/part-time employment conditions that are outside of their current contractual arrangement if they want to see any progress. At least then they should come under some kind of minimum wage law. Lamenting the issues of the industry as if they are some kind of force of nature that is part-and-parcel with the nature of the work seems intentionally ignorant to me. They only have to suffer these conditions because of the companies they are working for.

It's all well and good for the commenters here to say that dream jobs will often have hard conditions, but that doesn't necessarily have to be so if we have government or union enforced labour conditions that aren't predatory.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#69

Post by systemvoltage » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:42 AM UTC

ClemFandango wrote: post #68

Is nobody going to address the series of elephants in the room here? Even the embedded video in the article didn't say anything about it, and the author's proposed and current solution is more or less a social band-aid. These animators need to unionise, or demand full-time/part-time employment conditions that are outside of their current contractual arrangement if they want to see any progress. At least then they sho…

It could be that the supply for animators far exceeds the demand. No amount of bandaid is going to fix that.

Re: About 90% of Animators Quit Their Jobs Within 3 Years

#70

Post by chmod600 » Mon, Aug 09, 2021, 4:45 AM UTC

afterburner wrote: post #27

chmod600 wrote: post #8

Most people are probably best off with good jobs that sound boring but are highly demanded. Could be plumber or software engineer or accountant or whatever. People are happy to see you, happy when you do your job, and pay you well. People work as a team rather than compete. Don't underestimate the value of pleasantness in day to day interactions. Cool sounding jobs are competitive and you are likely to be treated poo…

> People are happy to see you, happy when you do your job Never had a bad manager huh?

Maybe your manager is mean, but maybe customers, coworkers, or partner businesses are happy. I don't mean it's all roses, but usually someone somewhere is happy even for fairly simple tasks.

But not necessarily for, say, a starving actor. Nobody really appreciates that you delivered a one-line part as an extra in a B movie. Anyone you work with is likely to either be jealous that you got a line, or feels you owe them for the priviledge of allowing you to say the line. And the viewers don't notice or care.