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In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

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Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#161

Post by josephcsible »

midev wrote: post #140
rblatz wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is your deal. You are out here arguing in bad faith all over this thread. What is your motivation?

What's the bad faith? What's single thing have I said that is incorrect? It's not breaking E2E encryption. No one is locking people up for political photos. It's not using facial recongition. I don't like FUD driving discussions. I think we need to have serious discussions about this technology. I think people that don't understand it shouldn't participate....

> It's not breaking E2E encryption.

It's not breaking it, but it is rendering it moot. Why even bother with E2E encryption if you can't trust your endpoint? Would upgrading your exterior door's security protect you from theft if it's your roommate who's stealing from you?

> No one is locking people up for political photos.

Authoritarian dictatorships like China are, and they'd love to use this tool to help them with that.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#162

Post by dannyw »

Animats wrote: post #152

Take a close look at the way this works. If there are enough hash matches, Apple apparently gets to look at all the pictures on the phone. The description says "threshold reached, all content visible and unlocked". "All", not "Matched". Matches can be forced from the outside, by sending pictures to the phone. They don't even have to be from the known-bad image set. Using an adversarial system to try to create hash ma…

Even regardless of whether it's all photos or all matched photos, the issue is that Apple is actively and publicly building adversarial black boxes that run on your device, on a OS level (on iOS AND macs!), with the sole and explicit goal of snitching on you to the government for possessing information that is deemed wrong.

The actual specifics of what material is currently deemed wrong is irrelevant, because it will be expanded.

This. Is. Not Okay.

This is something you'd expect China to mandate, not a Western company like Apple to advertise as a feature.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#163

Post by option_greek »

midev wrote: post #140
rblatz wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is your deal. You are out here arguing in bad faith all over this thread. What is your motivation?

What's the bad faith? What's single thing have I said that is incorrect? It's not breaking E2E encryption. No one is locking people up for political photos. It's not using facial recongition. I don't like FUD driving discussions. I think we need to have serious discussions about this technology. I think people that don't understand it shouldn't participate....

Arguing about what's possible today while wilfully ignoring what's possible tomorrow. It almost feels like you are a GPT3 bot.

I wish we had a bot detector in place.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#164

Post by kgarten »

Wondering If this implementation is related to the chat control effort in the EU:

https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/posts/message-screening/?la...

Just installing graheneos on a pixel, writing this from my Librem 14 (got it after the M1, the phoning home of apple apps, the new lockdown of kernel extensions).

Goodbye Apple.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#165

Post by mclightning »

RavlaAlvar wrote: post #73

I really don’t understand why apple is doing this. What point are they trying to score and from whom ? Do they think implementing a spyware in iPhone would boost sales? Or does it bring revenue from charging government agency to use this feature? I just don’t get it.

So they can claim only Pedos use android

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#166

Post by soperj »

midev wrote: post #100
eurasiantiger wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Add hashes of police uniforms and now you cannot take pictures of law enforcement. Add hashes of politicians. Businessmen in suits. Army uniforms. At the end you have a weapon that can only shoot civilians.

Do you know how discovery works in court? I'm guessing not. Once a hash matches, law enforcement would need a subpoena to access the raw image. If a person were to be arrested, that evidence would be turned over to the defense. It would be very obvious that a picture of a police officer was not child pornography. Are you under the impression people are jailed for hash collisions? Because that's not the case at all...…

It's like you think everyone operates under US law, or don't give a shit about anyone who doesn't.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#167

Post by guessbest »

Animats wrote: post #152

Take a close look at the way this works. If there are enough hash matches, Apple apparently gets to look at all the pictures on the phone. The description says "threshold reached, all content visible and unlocked". "All", not "Matched". Matches can be forced from the outside, by sending pictures to the phone. They don't even have to be from the known-bad image set. Using an adversarial system to try to create hash ma…

Anyone can already do that by sending a iOS user an incriminating message via airdrop or sharing an album. Unless this search is limited to only photos saved to the personal Photos Album, all apps on the iOS device become an evidence plant attack vector including the built in mail app, third party apps that can accept image messages or have planted illegal images, and even iMessage.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#169

Post by Hamuko »

akamaka wrote: post #26

As a thought experiment, why not allow us to disable the scanning feature in our iPhone settings? The entire premise of this system is that the targeted users are ignorant of its existence. If we can be so sure they don't know it exists, then surely having an option to disable it would cause no difference in outcome. If the people in favor of this system don't like the idea of making it optional, perhaps that shows t…

You can disable it by turning off iCloud Photos.

For now at least, who knows about the future since it's on-device and doesn't actually require you to upload anything.

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