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An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

appleprivacyletter.com

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Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#251

Post by rcruzeiro »

pgoggijr wrote: post #238
marcosdumay wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your gmail messages live on Google's servers. It's not ok for them to scan everything, but it's completely different from Apple scanning your phone's content.

The hashes are computed from images that live in iCloud - how is this different?

Suppose Apple flags some image in iCloud using a hash that was probably sent from the device. Do they currently have the capability to decrypt the image to check if the content is actually illegal before reporting it to the authorities without needing access to the physical device?

(Not trying to make a counter-argument to your comment. I genuinely don't get this part).

Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#252

Post by wayneftw »

judge2020 wrote: post #168
sundvor wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The privacy implications are fucking horrible. As an Android user I'd love to gloat, after all Apple have really had the upper edge on privacy so far, and their users have not been shy about telling us. Again and again. However any pleasure would be as short lived as peeing your pants to keep warm in winter, because if Apple proceeds, Google is bound to follow. A user monitoring system like this is just ripe for abus…

Google Photos runs PhotoDNA on all photos there, so it’s no different from Apple scanning photos destined for iCloud photos with similar tech. I guess the only pushback is that apple has decided to do it on-device (still only to photos going to iCloud Photos) instead of server-side, where they have to disable E2EE to do so?

> I guess the only pushback is that apple has decided to do it on-device.

This is exactly what my problem is. They are using my CPU, battery time and network bandwidth to do this when they should be using their own resources. I know I can turn off iCloud but I am paying for that and we already have an agreement in place.

Honestly, it's the only concrete thing to complain about. Every other complaint is based on a what-if, slippery slope concern.

Of course, as per usual, nobody agrees with me here on HN... but that's fine with me because they simply don't reply which lets me know that they don't have any good arguments against my PoV.

Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#253

Post by relax88 »

voakbasda wrote: post #186
post_break wrote: post #136

If Apple doesn't change on this my next phone will not be an iPhone. I will dump my iPad, and Apple watch as well. This is complete bullshit. I'm angry. I never thought I'd see "privacy" Apple come out and say we're going to scan your photos on your device, scan you imessages, etc. This is insane.

I gave up on Macs almost 20 years ago, but I have an iPhone 7 that I need to upgrade. This whole shitshow has put that purchase on hold indefinitely.

I just got an iPhone 12 a couple months ago because “Hey it’s definitely more private than google”, better control of app permissions, and nice hardware.

Seems unclear what the alternative is now. The Linux phones I’ve looked at have a lot of catching up to do.

Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#255

Post by bambax »

dijit wrote: post #130
d--b wrote: post #116

You guys can get outraged all you want. It's pretty clear that Apple debated this internally and decided that the backlash was worth whatever they got from this deal... By today, it's pretty clear than privacy is not the top priority of most people. See how much data people are giving fb/google every second...

This defeatist attitude is not helpful. The louder people are about this, the more it hurts and the more likely the policy is reversed. if the policy is not reversed, then at least the community has been loud enough that people took notice and understood that this is happening, giving them a chance to vote with their wallet; for most people what happens on a computer or a phone is a complete mystery.

> This defeatist attitude is not helpful.

Maybe, but it's the truth. It's impossible Apple didn't think this through. They did, and they made a decision, and Google will do the exact same thing in 6 months if not earlier.

Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#256

Post by sneak »

ipodopt wrote: post #162
SirensOfTitan wrote: post #105

I know the privacy approach Apple has been pushing was just marketing, but I didn't care too much because I enjoyed my iPhone and M1 macbook. Because of this decision (and the fact that my iPhone more-or-less facilitates poor habits throughout my life), I'm considering moving completely out of the Apple ecosystem. Does anyone have any recommendations for replacements? * On laptops: I have an X1 carbon extreme running…

Laptop | Desktop: https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/overview/cp/linuxsystem... Router: https://www.turris.com/en/omnia/overview/ Media Center: https://osmc.tv/vero/ Cloud (Use TrueNAS Scale): https://www.truenas.com/systems-overview/ Phone: https://www.pine64.org/pinephone/ Watch: https://pine64.com/product/pinetime-smartwatch-sealed/ Smart Thermostat: https://hestiapi.com/product/hestiapi-touch-one-free-shippin..…

The dell and lenovo laptops are nowhere the quality of the apple machines, sadly.

I have a maxed out xps and it is a downgrade in all respects but privacy. :/

Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#257

Post by hughrr »

p410n3 wrote: post #235
klysm wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean eBay isn’t exactly free of bad behavior…

I think they're just selling their iDevices on there

Yes that. I'd rather take them back to the Apple store and have a large fire out the front while holding up a doom saying sign about their laughable privacy stance, but that'd detract from the point.

Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology

#259

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

judge2020 wrote: post #198
jll29 wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or manipulating photos a little so the classifier deems them dangerous: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXy6oX1iNoA

This isn’t a neutral network classifier, it’s an algorithm that searches against existing CSAM photos. https://www.apple.com/child-safety/pdf/CSAM_Detection_Techni...

That's potentially, even worse. It means that the 'relevant authorities" can substitute any images they want, whenever they want.
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