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Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

theguardian.com

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Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#301

Post by throw0101a »

handrous wrote: post #239
tablespoon wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The craziness with the GOP started more recently (post-1990s). IIRC, you can date that phase to 1994 and Newt Gingrich. Though that was maybe more like phase II, with phase I starting in ~1980 with Reagan.

Yep. The late 70s and early 80s mark the beginning of several strategies, policies, and chess moves that paid off big time in the 90s. The neoliberal movement gained a major presence in the Republican Party at the beginning of that span, and by the early 90s it had also captured the Democrats. The Fairness Doctrine fell, and its absence was quickly exploited. The ball took a while to get rolling, but was moving fast…

> The neoliberal movement gained a major presence in the Republican Party at the beginning of that span, and by the early 90s it had also captured the Democrats.

Fairly well document in Kurt Anderson's recent book:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Geniuses:_The_Unmaking_of...

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#302

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #42
holoduke wrote: post #33

Nuclear power is needed everywhere. All major grids. And all containerships. Doable in 20-40 years with some serious effort.

Nuclear container ships are such a good idea. It is maddening we haven't done this and only turn war ships into nuclear power.

'We' already did this a few decades ago:

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NS_Savannah

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Hahn_(ship)

But thinking about it, do you really think it would be wise to do that with the way current sea transport is implemented?

Have a look at

[3] https://www.agcs.allianz.com/news-and-insights/reports/shipp...

I think this could only be countered by implementing it with an engineering-, work- and safety 'culture' like it has been established by

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyman_G._Rickover

And even then we'd probably need several

[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glomar_Explorer

on stand by, not 'just in case' but because 'shit happens'.

Who would pay for this? In a world/economy/society where everything is bought and contracted from the lowest bidder, including personnel/crew.

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#303

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

whoooooo123 wrote: post #99
jacquesm wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a non-proliferation issue more than anything else.

What if one of them gets lodged sideways in the Suez Canal?

Then some atomic pharao comes by to say hi!

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#304

Post by sizzle »

davesque wrote: post #95
backprop1993 wrote: post #79

I think back to how we have responded to this pandemic. We were in denial until the pandemic was spreading unchecked wildly through the population, and even a good chunk of the population is still in denial after 100,000s of dead. We are a hopeless species when it comes to organizing effective collective action ahead of known disaster. We seem to only respond collectively once disaster has struck, and even then it ta…

Don't give up hope. We licked CFCs and leaded gasoline. There are probably plenty of other times in history when we mobilized to solve a problem at scale. These are discouraging times for sure. But ultimately there's just no point in being hopeless.

What’s the reference of licking cfcs referring to?

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#305

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

jacquesm wrote: post #127
74d-fe6-2c6 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you must be pretty delusional to even consider the next generation to be more farsighted. they'll just suffer and blame their parents.

I did say I hoped. I do not have any illusions about the chances of that hope being realized. What goes up can definitely - and must eventually - go down. This one is on us.

Not when it reaches escape velocity and accelerates further to hyperbolic excess velocity.

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#306

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

jacquesm wrote: post #228
myth_drannon wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Novosibirsk, Russia is 1m+ city... with some effort you can live. Russians are obsessed about populating their country all over even in the most inhospitable places vs Canadians who are just fine with living south of 60th parallel.

Go ask them how many of them would like to move family and all to Paris or Amsterdam and how many people from Paris or Amsterdam would like to move to Novosibirsk. I've lived in Northern Canada. Snow isn't nearly as much fun as it is cracked up to be when there is 6+ months of it in some years (I recall one year where the snowplow went on the tractor in October and we had the last snow in June). Those areas are well…

Gamify it. Make them think it's practice for settling on some ice planet! Sell tickets via a lottery for the real thing some time really soon.

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#307

Post by kenny11 »

sizzle wrote: post #304
davesque wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't give up hope. We licked CFCs and leaded gasoline. There are probably plenty of other times in history when we mobilized to solve a problem at scale. These are discouraging times for sure. But ultimately there's just no point in being hopeless.

What’s the reference of licking cfcs referring to?

Banning ozone-depleting chlorofluorocarbons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montreal_Protocol

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#308

Post by jtms »

sizzle wrote: post #304
davesque wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't give up hope. We licked CFCs and leaded gasoline. There are probably plenty of other times in history when we mobilized to solve a problem at scale. These are discouraging times for sure. But ultimately there's just no point in being hopeless.

What’s the reference of licking cfcs referring to?

CFC == Chlorofluorocarbons, "lick" is slang for "defeating". It means we passed law prohibiting the use of CFCs.

Re: Observation-based early-warning signals for a collapse of the Gulf Stream

#310

Post by sdossick »

jay_kyburz wrote: post #246
Overton-Window wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Per capita figures are meaningless. You're discussing imaginary lines in the dirt. The only way to tackle climate change is to bring down global emissions.

The point he was making, and I agree, is that you can't expect people in China to make sacrifices unless you do first. Lets get our own personal emissions down first, then point the finger at China.

Let's mess up the West's economy first, and then beg the autocrats in China to mess theirs up too?
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