301–310 of 471 posts
For those who don’t know, SIWA is fully supported for web logins, and it’s implementation is pretty easy.
As the author seems to be active here, let me add my voice to those who are saying I will never choose to use an app written by someone with this level of disdain for me.
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Indeed it is. And I would choose to trust Apple over some nobody on the internet with a seeming chip on their shoulder (seriously, that post is just cringe ) over anyone who promoted Facebook and (to a lesser extent, obviously) Google as sign-in methods. In. A. Heartbeat. You claim (elsewhere) that you only send responsible-sounding emails, but the level of invective in your screed leads me to disbelieve you. Persona…
I challenge you to sign up (with Apple ID if you wish) and see for yourself how many emails you get. Otherwise you're accusing without evidence I don't challenge that Apple ID is a good thing. I protest Apple's method of implementation
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Not objecting. I don't need email addresses for the case of AppleID users. 100% true I do need them for everyone else who comes from traditional signup However, you seem to have missed the point. My problem is not AppleID, my problem is that Apple forced it on my app and threatened to shut me down if I didn't include it
Right, except that your “problem” is also the relationship Apple has with its customers. You did nothing to build the trust and loyalty that you mock in your snarky write-up. Apple did, to the point that their users would prefer to trust them with their personal information over someone else (you). The tone of your whole piece is sophomoric- you essentially suggest that all of Apple’s customers are uninformed and lac…
Please replace every mention of "Apple user" with "Apple". It really is the only wrong party here
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Thanks, the web app isn't published yet and I will take this into consideration
For a more professional notice, I'd try something more like "Apple required us to choose between either supporting Sign-in with Apple in the iOS app, or disabling the logins of all existing users who had signed in with Google and Facebook. In protest of these abusive requirements, sign-in with Apple will not be supported online."
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To this date, I have sent 0 marketing emails trying to sell stuff. Heck, I don't even try to sell anything, I develop out of love and passion. The only reason email is needed is for password recovery But yes, Apple is great. Again, Apple is great. Apple good, good good good
> To this date To this date. Tomorrow, though, no one knows. > I have sent 0 marketing emails trying to sell stuff. "I", "I", "I". It's not you. It's me. I don't care what you say you're going to do with it. I don't want to give you my email address to store in another database. I'm sure you're very nice, but sorry not sorry. > The only reason email is needed is for password recovery You don't need my email at all if…
Now you CAN choose to say, "I don't want those users", if they do not fit into your grand plan of things.
Apple does forward emails, so you can even contact those users for your password recovery use case you mentioned in other comments. I think your problem is not the fact that you do not have an email ID, your problem is, your users have the option of pulling the carpet from under you.
I like the angle of "Sorry, Apple ID only works on Apple devices." The rest of the popup seems unprofessional and would make me reconsider using the software, out of fear for what other unprofessional things may end up happening. But the bit I highlight is a nice jab at Apple and something I think you can get away with professionally in a web app. It mars their login brand a bit by showing that it isn't useful everyw…
> I like the angle of "Sorry, Apple ID only works on Apple devices." Except it's inaccurate, it works on Android, Windows and in browsers https://support.apple.com/kb/HT211687 Agreed on all other points though, if you want to garner sympathy from your users, that's definitely not how to do it.
I'm pretty sure there is an implied "on this app" in there. But I agree that the formulation could be seen as ambiguous.
This is a perfect example of why Sign in with Apple is so great: it hides my e-mail and real name from people like the author who are clearly intent on using this information to sell me stuff I don't want.
To this date, I have sent 0 marketing emails trying to sell stuff. Heck, I don't even try to sell anything, I develop out of love and passion. The only reason email is needed is for password recovery But yes, Apple is great. Again, Apple is great. Apple good, good good good
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> As a user I do not want yet another company getting my details and assembling a profile on me under the excuse of fraud prevention This is only done after an explicit opt-in when using just that payment method. It's actually done as part of a credit check and those have to be very explicit.
That’s when you explicitly ask the user for their real email address. This is not difficult unless you want to make it so for the purpose of raging at apple.
- Do users understand the fact that they have not given us their email address? Our email turns up in their inbox after all. Our customers are not necessarily tech-savvy of even that comfortable with email.
- Do users know, months after signing up, that they didn't give us their email address.
- Many users don't actually read information longer than ~5 words unless they're seeking out FAQs or something. They mostly pattern-match to things they know and/or expect.
- Interrupting a checkout flow to explain all of this and capture a real email address will significantly reduce conversion. Is it overall better accounting for the hopeful improvement from Sign in with Apple? Very hard to say, even with testing, and we've tested things like this in the past.
- Will Apple allow it? Open question, they don't explicitly say either way but there's plenty of evidence to suggest they don't want it being done.
> This is not difficult unless you want to make it so for the purpose of raging at apple
There's a difference between raging and critique. I'm critical of what I see as poorly designed systems and policies, particularly where it seems like there are industries/business models that are blind spots to Apple, intentional or otherwise.
Saying that I'm raging at Apple is funny to me because I lead our project to introduce an iOS app at my current company, I've worked at an indie Mac software company, I have used macOS for many years. Hell, I even liked Objective-C. In many ways I'm just yet another Apple fanboy.
Constructive criticism is important in moving platforms forward. Right now, Apple SSO doesn't work for us for well defined UX and business reasons. If those are solved then it will likely align well with how we want to treat our users and we'll likely introduce it.
If you force me to use email login, I’m going to feed you a burner email (thank you fastmail!) and call it a day.
The difference with AppleID is that I get a much better experience, my device automatically does what I would do anyway.
You don’t want to support a feature? It’s you app, do what you want. But the post reads like some lame justification (and a petty one at that).
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Not objecting. I don't need email addresses for the case of AppleID users. 100% true I do need them for everyone else who comes from traditional signup However, you seem to have missed the point. My problem is not AppleID, my problem is that Apple forced it on my app and threatened to shut me down if I didn't include it
You don't want to understand. Apple users are happy that they forced you. They like the AppleID experience and nobody would care to implement it if they didn't force developers. I know it's frustrating for you, but this is the core of why Apple users stick to Apple. They decided to trust and share their data with one single company (Apple) instead of an overwhelming amount of small companies. And it's not just about…
As an Apply user I'm quite happy that they keep devs on their toes. The industry as a whole went super user-hostile. Forced updates in Docker unless you pay, other apps doing bait-and-switch all the time.
Apply is like an island with cool shade from trees in the ocean filled with hungry sharks.