How so many educated, intelligent people seem to think that we (as a species, or even as Americans) are so resource-poor that “space exploration” and “improving the earth” yield an either/or decision absolutely mystifies me. You want to free up resources for either one? Start with global military spending and the financial sector. Both have their place and both have grown far beyond it.
Look at the numbers. SpaceX is doing it’s thing for a few billion a year. That’s chump change compared to the money being spent on, let’s say professional basketball. Not picking on basketball it’s my favorite spectator sport. But saying, if you want to find something less worthy than “improving the earth”, you have about a hundred better targets than space exploration.
SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
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Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#392Earlier quoted context omitted.
Using these resources to improve chemical flamethrowers is sub-optimal. A dead end. Nuclear fusion is a more likely answer to spaceflight and Earth's clean energy problem. It likely should be the priority.
Even if we pretended that it's rational to hedge all your bets on not only having a working fusion reacter in the near term future but having the capability to miniturise it to a degree where it could be used as an engine for a launch vehicle, you would still be dead wrong. Fusion still shares the same fundumental problem that chemical rockets or even more advanced options like blackhole or antimatter drives face - t…
Likely necessary for advanced space flight. Likely necessary to allow for "clean energy" on earth. Unlike advances to flamethrowers.
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#393Earlier quoted context omitted.
None of that would have happened without Werner von Braun and his crew. And Russia beat the US to space to begin with. Yes, SpaceX could only happen in the United States. But let't not pretend that the whole American package warrants the 'favored and exceptional nation' badge that so many seem to want to bestow on it, which is what this American exceptionalism is all about. Shining city on the hill and more of that k…
> None of that would have happened without Werner von Braun and his crew One cannot ignore that they did their later work here. Not there. As did many others whose own societies collapsed or otherwise failed them. In any case, I’m arguing a narrow argument: that a company like SpaceX could only have been founded, when it was founded, in America. Because of its certain characteristics that are an exception in the set…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip
In a more just world they would have stood trial in Nuremberg.
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#394Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is a very practical reason: Starlink. Launching all those Starlink sats on Falcon 9 must be much more expensive than they would like, and Starship aims to provide a considerably higher payload capacity with much lower cost (if the re-usability plans work out). Apart from that, Musk is great at marketing and sometimes full of crap, but when you listen to some of his converstions it's not hard to believe that the…
I am still not convinced Starlink being really cheaper than ground based fibre. Exceptions I can think off: - military application, but they have their solutions - on high seas, no idea how that works now - regions maintaining ground stations is risky (war zones and so on) Maybe I am wrong, but I have the impression Starlink is for SpaceX is what FSD is for Tesla, a way to "raise" money. And that is working. I am jus…
Most of my extended family lives in rural Tennessee where their internet options are still dial-up and 5G. Comcast isn't interested in laying additional fiber to remote houses. There are options through AT&T, but I think they end up paying close to $20/GB.
Several of my relatives are pretty pumped about StarLink as a potential option.
I think the niche for StarLink is this - outlying communities where traditional ISPs are uninterested in building out infrastructure for the 'long tails' of the population.
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#395Earlier quoted context omitted.
Look at the numbers. SpaceX is doing it’s thing for a few billion a year. That’s chump change compared to the money being spent on, let’s say professional basketball. Not picking on basketball it’s my favorite spectator sport. But saying, if you want to find something less worthy than “improving the earth”, you have about a hundred better targets than space exploration.
> SpaceX is doing it’s thing for a few billion a year One can project from SpaceX's launch history that as the commercialization of space intensifies, this figure is going to continue to grow exponentially https://www.spacexstats.xyz/#launchhistory-per-year
First of all, just because the trend is exponential now doesn't mean it always will be. That's silly.
Second of all, the number of launches may be increasing at that rate because the launches have been made exponentially cheaper - why don't we look at % of GDP being put into space flight? I bet it would be flat or trending down.
Am I missing something here? I just don't think your implicit concerns are well-founded.
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#396Earlier quoted context omitted.
Even if we pretended that it's rational to hedge all your bets on not only having a working fusion reacter in the near term future but having the capability to miniturise it to a degree where it could be used as an engine for a launch vehicle, you would still be dead wrong. Fusion still shares the same fundumental problem that chemical rockets or even more advanced options like blackhole or antimatter drives face - t…
The difference between chemical/fission and fusion are orders of magnitude. It is "Today’s best chemical rockets produce propellant exhaust velocities up to 4.5 km/s. Fission (nuclear thermal) rocket engines could roughly double that, to about 8.5 km/s. A working nuclear fusion core producing thrust through direct exhaust of hot plasma, could readily generate up to ~1000 km/s exhaust velocities" - https://link.spring…
They only come into their own once they are already in space or in orbit which returns us to the problem that we need to have launch assist infrastructure that can deal with that first step without resorting to those "flamethrowers" as you call them.
It's also not true at all that fusion is necessary to allow for clean energy (even ignoring that many of the near term fusion reactor designs still need to have radiation shielding to deal with dangerous neutron emissions). We could use a combination of renewable sources and nuclear fission to deal with the energy crisis now and then utilise fusion once it's finally matured to the point of usefulness. Indeed, we could use that orbital infrastructure to help construct a planetary cloud of solar collectors that can operate 24/7 and beam that energy down via microwave rectiner technology that is already capable of achieving greater than 85% energy conversion (keep in mind that we lose far more energy simply from the diffusion of sunlight through the atmosphere). This approach not only can power the earth but any off earth colonisation prospects with line of sight with our planetary cloud - without needing to haul the likely massive early generation fusion reactors.
Neither is fusion necessary for advanced space travel. It would be very useful but chiefly for travel to under-developed sectors of the solar system. solar reflectors scaled up enough can be used to speed up and slow down entire fleets of ships with far higher potential top speeds than even antimatter drives permit (since there is no requirement to have onboard propellant). They also double as handy point defense systems for dealing with both debris and ships that are attempting to turn themselves into relativistic kill missiles - remember that there is no such thing as an unarmed space ship, they are all potential weapons of mass destruction, especially once we reach the state where we have fusion drive powered ones.
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#397Earlier quoted context omitted.
Lol, the last time NASA built a space plane to do real work in space, it was grossly inefficient than the previous giant dick it replaced, wildly more dangerous, and NASA had to attach it to three other dicks just to get it to space. Face it man, people making fun of dick shaped rockets are seeing dicks where no one else is seeing them and calling themselves clever.
"Lol", "Face it man", you're laser-focused in on a tiny, fairly irrelevant detail of my comment while very ardently ignoring the substantive points. No-one cares what shape the rockets are. Fwiw the space plane I was referring to above was SS2, not a NASA vehicle. But yes, I agree, it is unlikely to be good for doing "real work in space". Which is the actual substantive point here, irrespective of vehicle shape. Just…
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#398Earlier quoted context omitted.
But environmental destruction is way up. A good example is river health. We can provide more meat with high density grazing. But the waste products have to go somewhere, so the farmers spread them across their fields. Now when it rains, these run into the rivers and we get algae bloom. Majority of rivers in UK are now dying, for example. Have we discovered a sustainable way of producing more meat in less space? I hop…
> Modern agriculture has enabled us to support a larger world population with less labour and less space, but can we continue as we are for another 50 years? I keep pointing to the fact that negative population growth is already baked in to the world's population pyramid, and responders conveniently continue to ignore that fact. We DO NOT have to "continue as we are for another 50 years". In 50 years there will be de…
If the population size goes down but consumption per person goes up by an equivalent amount (easy to imagine when US citizen emits 5x carbon of average citizen of many other countries) we have the same problem.
If things are so rosy environmentally, why are so many species going extinct due to habitat loss?
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#399Earlier quoted context omitted.
> None of that would have happened without Werner von Braun and his crew One cannot ignore that they did their later work here. Not there. As did many others whose own societies collapsed or otherwise failed them. In any case, I’m arguing a narrow argument: that a company like SpaceX could only have been founded, when it was founded, in America. Because of its certain characteristics that are an exception in the set…
Calling Werner von Braun an immigrant is a funny thing to do. Immigrants tend to have some choice in the matter. Von Braun and his band of rocket experts were given a pretty stark choice, surrender to the Russians or surrender to the Americans, they chose the latter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip In a more just world they would have stood trial in Nuremberg.
Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night
#400Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's basic English dude, let's not complicate it. It's very easy to see what was meant by that, and it's a common sentiment all over the internet that these "space barons" should reallocate their resources towards saving the planet. If you insist on using 3rd party interpretation rather than 1st party intent to decide the meaning of a statement, I've got 16 upvotes on my comments here so others seem to be reading it…
>If you insist on using 3rd party interpretation rather than 1st party intent to decide the meaning of a statement, I've got 16 upvotes on my comments here so others seem to be reading it the same as I "Argument by upvote" is weak, especially in a forum where I can't actually see your comments vote totals. Also, you are not the first party, so why do you feel so confident in being able to claim sole interpretation of…