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South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

nationalinterest.org

131–140 of 444 posts

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pay people to be stay at home parents so they don't face an enormous opportunity cost / survival threat to having a kid.

They do that in France, and birth rates are actually higher than most Western nations

I could not find anything on this. I see that they have payments to support households with kids but do they specifically pay people to be stay at home parents?

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#133
post #94

All of these kind of propaganda is the same. But nationalinterest is a propaganda outlet and the author "is a Member on the policy advisory boards of the Ministry of Unification, the Ministry of Defense, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, and the National Assembly's Committee on Unification, Diplomacy, and Trade." Without reading the article - "Western" values/democracy, "liberal values" and lgbt. I guarantee it. First…

It's pretty disgusting that this crap is upvoted on Hacker News. This site's slow descent into reactionary politics is saddening

How dare someone not be a liberal!

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

South Korea, Taiwan, and China all developed their infrastructure relatively recently, so it makes sense that their skyscrapers and subway systems are gleaming. Fast forward 50 years (once the demographic collapse has fully hit Asia and Europe), and we'll see if their infrastructure continues to be so modern.

Yes but compared to Japan? All of Asia started from scratch after WW2 and Korea was only 10 years behind Japan due to their war. But Tokyo infrastructure felt basically as old as NYC infrastructure to me (a totally qualitative impression). That said, Tokyo is massively cleaner and nicer than NYC even if some of the infrastructure seems old. There is no question it is nicer than NYC.

I live in Tokyo - on the surface certain lines have dated exteriors on their trains and stations, but they are maintained so much better and built with much more care to the surrounding environment that it's impossible for me to compare with NYC.

NYC's trains are constantly late, always go out of service, are deafeningly loud, incredibly slow, filthy, don't have great coverage outside of the Manhattan core and generally unreliable. Tokyo's are always on time, very clean, pretty silent, have incredible coverage of the entire metro area especially in combination with the bus networks (which also are efficient, clean, and don't hold lower-class stigma), and are super fast.

The lines that aren't underground in NYC tend to be depressing under the tracks and pretty unlivable around them, leading to tons of urban blight; the over-ground lines in Tokyo, thanks to their thoughtful design and reasonable noise level, are often full of shops, restaurants, bars, and walking paths that people actually use, positively contributing to their neighborhoods.

The main thing that feels "old" about Tokyo's trains is just that they look like they were decorated a long time ago or are kinda plain; but from a functional perspective they outclass practically any system on the planet, especially when taking into account the integration into the broader Shinkansen network. They have the best safety record of any rail system anywhere and are economically sustaining. The only major complaint I have is that it's relatively expensive fare-wise, especially considering transfers between different rail companies' lines/buses.

Also, it's worth checking out the pre-Olympics revamp of some lines - for instance Ginza Line (Shibuya station especially) and Odakyu Line (Setagaya Daita-Shimokitazawa in particular) got a lot of station and neighborhood renovations that give them that sparkly new shine.

Aside, I've also lived in Shanghai before - the rail network in China is something to watch, their high speed rail stations and urban networks are very nice as of late, although they need more express lines within city limits (Shanghai/Beijing are enormous so crossing the city by rail takes a long time).

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#135
post #124
post #7

SK is committing demographic suicide though, so whatever you think of its success, it has a pretty fatal disease. It has the lowest birthrate in the world. This is going to cause significant economic problems quite soon, or they will have to open up massive immigration which will completely change the country. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_birth_rate_in_South_Korea How does the developed world pull out of this ty…

Not really. Immigration has become an issue lately because a human (or a bare-human) is worth much less. 1.000 years ago a bare illiterate human had some considerable value. He could work in the field or he could fight. More humans, more food and production. More humans, more manpower to fight your enemies. Now a bare semi-educated human is a liability. Which is why most countries are refusing their entrance. Times h…

There's only so much juice you can squeeze out of a shrinking workforce, though.

And as retirees continue to make up a larger portion of the popular vote - they'll continue to demand more from a shrinking workforce.

At some point (I imagine in my lifetime) - the straw will break the camel's back.

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont find them particularly livable.Yeah maybe when you are in your 20-later 30s then they are livable but they are absolutely dreadful when it comes to having a family. All that convenience that you see is there because of that fast paced life style people have. Source: Married to korean and lived in Korea.

I lived in Korea for years and have visited Japan as well. Having lived in Toronto, South Korea (Ulsan), and now SF (Sunset), I can’t imagine a better place for a family to live than many neighbourhoods in Korea. Now that I’ve got a wife, dog, and newborn baby, we needed to purchase a car to get them around (since SF public transit isn’t good enough for this). At least in Toronto we were within a few hundred metres o…

My take on living in Korea vs Europe (I have no idea about cities in North America)

1. Noisy apartments and noisy streets typical for asian megalopolises.If you can afford to live in one of the more quality condos it's better though.

2. Commuting by subway for an 1h with 1-2 stops to change lines is dreadful during peak hours.It's worse than commuting by car from a suburb here in Europe.Michael Wolf's video captures this very well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxZLq3IpYAU

Living in Korea is convenient but not comfortable.

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One core issue is housing. And the core issue with housing is that prices are an arms race where everyone always wants more. Most people would have two or three kids if they felt like they could afford it. The second core issue is modern dating. That one I don't know how to fix, but the essential issue there is the dynamics of dating not requiring commitment coupled with financial security for women mean long term pa…

I don't know about South Korea, but looking at some other asian countries, there are a couple of things, I think the housing part falls into number 3 but is only a small part of the whole: 1. Having children without being married has a bunch of problems, and in some countries like singapore gets punished for it in lack of certain social services 2. Most of these societies expect women to work or have their husband ta…

I wonder if we need UBI to stabilize the birthrate. Basically if people have some assurance that their kids can be supported and have decent prospects in life then perhaps they will have more kids.

Also, our big cities have evolved to serve adults vs children. We have a proliferation of services for adults: sit in restaurants, cafes, coffeehouses, etc… Just look at turnstiles to the subway and the stairs you need to ascend/descend. Good luck trying to push strollers or drag children around in our urban areas.

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#138
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average price of an apartment in Seoul is hitting $1M and the avg gdp per capita is around $38k.I am afraid a lot of that wealth is just real estate market speculation that might burst when the supply outstrips demand in 50 years.

I doubt that there will be a major, irrecoverable housing crash in South Korea within the lifetime of anyone who grew up believing that their children will support them later on. In the meantime, retirees who own nothing but an expensive apartment can reverse-mortgage their homes for a stable source of income. The bank, not their children, will inherit the property. Two reasons why I don't think there will be a suppl…

I hope you are right for the sake of both of us.

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#139
post #98
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One factor that needs to be considered is that in Korea, as in many Asian regions, people are expected to look after their parents when they get old. Society and social security have been build around this assumption.

That's been changing very rapidly in SK. Almost everyone in their 40s and 50s today have been putting money into public pension plans as well as a multitude of private options. When they retire, they won't be economically dependent on their children. Nor can they expect to, because their children's generation is by all means poorer than their own. Whether those public funds and private options will be enough, of cour…

There is no magic in this world. When you make an investment into a company, you become dependent on the people that work at that company.

When you're investing in a private fund, or in real estate, you're still relying on your children. The material wealth you are consuming is still being produced by the generations that come after.

If your children's generation is poorer than your own and if there is less of them, then there is nothing you can do except rely on the children of people in other countries.

Re: South Korea: The only middle power of its kind

#140

I don't see anyone mentioning this so I'll take a gander with my "modern jackass" [1] solution based on my own personal observations of the reasons why I don't want kids: I have so much I still want to do with my life and I want to sink what time free from work into dinners and trips with my wife. Given the extant threat modern nations face, why aren't they offering to care for and raise our children? They'd be raise…

> why aren't they offering to care for and raise our children?

But they do. You'd be surprised how many crucial skills are taught in kindergarten.

But there's also the question of scale - for certain things infants and children need their caregivers' undivided attention. Otherwise you end up with something akin to an orphanage, and there are plenty of data points suggesting that going in this direction is a very bad idea.

Overall some things are already being done, other don't scale, so it's up to the parents to do that and the government's role to make it as easy as possible.

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