SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night • Hacker News Board

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#121

Post by londons_explore » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:04 PM UTC

gridspy wrote: post #66

paxys wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The single most important job for humanity right now is to save this one planet we have from destruction. There is enough time to think about colonizing the stars after that. I'm as much into spaceships as the next nerd, but people need to get real. The world isn't going to end because his next launch is a month late due to pesky safety regulations or whatever else. This effort is going to play out over many generati…

I think the best way to save the planet is to move heavy industry into space. Move our power generation into space and beam it down. Make advanced technologies in space which benefit those on Earth. Move people into real orbital habitats. Make Earth proper a gigantic park / nature reserve. We can't "wait" for anything, or the window during which we can develop space travel will close. 10 or 100 years from now we migh…

The reason industry likes to be on earth is that so many materials are free or very cheap, and waste can be dumped into the atmosphere or waterways.

If industry had to pay launch costs for water, air, and other basic things they need, they wouldn't be financially viable.

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#122

Post by cma » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:06 PM UTC

tablespoon wrote: post #76

908B64B197 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only in America things like this can happen. A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; SpaceX is doing the same thing with flight hardware. Contrast that with previous generation engines (the RS-25 comes to mind) with a sticker price of 125 millions... per engine! [0] [0] https://spacenews.com/aerojet-rocketdyne-d…

>> Only in America things like this can happen. > Semi-Conductor doubling every 18 months IIRC, the recent doublings have been happening in Taiwan. That's why people make such a big deal about TMSC. America (i.e. Intel) actually has some catching up to do.

EUV LLC. that their current nodes are based on was started in America through DARPA, DoE, and a US industry consortium. That's why we are still allowed to enforce export restrictions on EUV tech via ASML, even though it is European.

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#123

Post by DanHulton » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:06 PM UTC

908B64B197 wrote: post #31

milansuk wrote: post #14

In 2019, Elon tweeted[0] that the price of one Raptor engine is under $1M with the goal going under 250K for the next version. Any recent info where there are now? I'm still surprised they moved to this orbital fly so quickly without doing more tests. Going from 3 engines to almost 30 is crazy. Also, If I understand it right, both booster and starship will end up in the ocean. I hope they will be able to reuse at lea…

Only in America things like this can happen. A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; SpaceX is doing the same thing with flight hardware. Contrast that with previous generation engines (the RS-25 comes to mind) with a sticker price of 125 millions... per engine! [0] [0] https://spacenews.com/aerojet-rocketdyne-d…

This is, quite literally, a comment about American Boosterism.

(Please, I'm not making a political point, I just cannot refrain from punning.)

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#124

Post by devoutsalsa » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:08 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #111

throw0101a wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Only in America things like this can happen. > A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; Silicon Valley did not bootstrap itself. It received untold billions of dollars from the US government during the Cold War (and lots of stuff happened during the WW2 economy, when the US was the Allies' armorer). Do you thin…

>> Notwithstanding the millions that NASA gave them in their early stages. And the billions spent on the technologies that allow those engines to exist. SpaceX didn't invent rocket engines. It stands on the shoulders of many giants going back through Apollo to the early days. There are even traces of Soviet tech in the raptor (ie closed cycle). Nearly all of that work was funded by taxpayers ... and by whatever funde…

Watching the Falcon Heavy take off & land was one of the coolest things in my life. Watching Starship take off, land, and blow up was neat. The fact that these things build on previous accomplishments doesn’t make them any less impressive. Enjoy the ride & don’t poop on the party.

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#125

Post by the_duke » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:08 PM UTC

908B64B197 wrote: post #105

treespace88 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In almost all other countries the rich use the government to keep competition out. All under the banner of national pride. In Canada we lock out all foreign investment in lots of areas.

I never understood why Canada would restrict international players from disrupting sectors like telecom (a commodity really) but didn't seem to have any problem with Airbus taking over the CSeries program for almost nothing.

OT, but:

> but didn't seem to have any problem with Airbus taking over the CSeries program for almost nothing.

This is actually a somewhat amusing to bring up in this context, because US protectionism is what made that happen.

Boeing tried to kill off the C-Series by getting the US administration to impose 300% (sic!) import duties because ... it threatened US jobs. Airbus was targeting the program aggressively as well with tactics like price matching, so the CSeries was already struggling before that.

Bombardies only viable way out was to join a partnership with Airbus (which got 50.1%), so the planes could be manufactured in their Alabama plant and it could be positioned within the Airbus product range instead of competing.

The partnership was forced move, and quite a big middle finger to Boeing. The alternative would have probably been just shutting it down.

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#126

Post by fiftyfifty » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:09 PM UTC

milansuk wrote: post #14

In 2019, Elon tweeted[0] that the price of one Raptor engine is under $1M with the goal going under 250K for the next version. Any recent info where there are now? I'm still surprised they moved to this orbital fly so quickly without doing more tests. Going from 3 engines to almost 30 is crazy. Also, If I understand it right, both booster and starship will end up in the ocean. I hope they will be able to reuse at lea…

This is hardly beyond standard practice in the industry. The SLS is going to orbital flight with no flight testing. Heck the Falcon Heavy launched a car past Mars' orbit on it's first flight. I think SpaceX's main goal was to refine their manufacturing process and make sure they can achieve a certain level of consistency in building these things. The fact that they installed all these Raptors before even doing a pressure test tells you they are far more confident in their processes than they were even 6 months ago.

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#127

Post by 908B64B197 » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:10 PM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #109

908B64B197 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood why Canada would restrict international players from disrupting sectors like telecom (a commodity really) but didn't seem to have any problem with Airbus taking over the CSeries program for almost nothing.

> disrupting sectors like telecom Perhaps the government doesn't like foreigns tapping Canadians' communications? The NSA listens in on its own citizens with the coöperation of the US telcos, so what chance would foreigners have? * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_(surveillance_program) As a Canadian I would certainly like more competition, but I can certainly see the reas…

> Perhaps the government doesn't like foreigns tapping Canadians' communications?

As if foreign countries needed to actually own the infrastructure to tap it [0]. All they need is to have employees inside with double allegiances [1] [2] [3]

[0] https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-canada-now-...

[1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-07-01/did-china...

[2] https://nationalpost.com/opinion/john-ivison-csis-right-to-w...

[3] https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/former-raytheon-engineer-sent...

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#128

Post by Pokepokalypse » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:10 PM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #98

908B64B197 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only in America things like this can happen. A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; SpaceX is doing the same thing with flight hardware. Contrast that with previous generation engines (the RS-25 comes to mind) with a sticker price of 125 millions... per engine! [0] [0] https://spacenews.com/aerojet-rocketdyne-d…

> Only in America things like this can happen. > A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; Silicon Valley did not bootstrap itself. It received untold billions of dollars from the US government during the Cold War (and lots of stuff happened during the WW2 economy, when the US was the Allies' armorer). Do you thin…

Spy satellites launch from Vandenberg due to the favorable azimuth for high-inclination orbits.

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#129

Post by 908B64B197 » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:12 PM UTC

project2501a wrote: post #120

908B64B197 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood why Canada would restrict international players from disrupting sectors like telecom (a commodity really) but didn't seem to have any problem with Airbus taking over the CSeries program for almost nothing.

> (a commodity really) you mean a utility, right?

Both really.

Once a location is served by more than one provider, it becomes a commodity (who can sell packets the cheapest).

Re: SpaceX installed 29 Raptor engines on a Super Heavy rocket last night

#130

Post by throwaway3neu94 » Mon, Aug 02, 2021, 11:13 PM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #98

908B64B197 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only in America things like this can happen. A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; SpaceX is doing the same thing with flight hardware. Contrast that with previous generation engines (the RS-25 comes to mind) with a sticker price of 125 millions... per engine! [0] [0] https://spacenews.com/aerojet-rocketdyne-d…

> Only in America things like this can happen. > A whole industry bootstrapping itself to make semi-conductors doubling every 18 months, going from exotic, mission critical hardware to commodity; Silicon Valley did not bootstrap itself. It received untold billions of dollars from the US government during the Cold War (and lots of stuff happened during the WW2 economy, when the US was the Allies' armorer). Do you thin…

> Do you think it a coïncidence that most spy satellites are launched from Vandenberg?

It's not a coincidence, it's geography.

It is desirable for reconnaissance satellites to cover the entire planet regularly. That means high inclination orbits. That means southward launches (as opposed to eastward). That requires a launch site with ideally lots of ocean and not a lot of population to the south/southeast.

The US does plenty of military launches into other orbits from the east coast.