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Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

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Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#71

Post by jstummbillig »

safog wrote: post #40
jcims wrote: post #16

It's not clear to me what the problem is that the article is outlining. The Dollar General near me has the exact same brands as you would find in any larger retail establishment, they just have found a way to stock the 80% that folks typically need. They are filling a niche between the gas station convenience store and traditional grocery/big box retail. They don't have a produce section, just a bit of fruit. Is that…

After a couple of levels of indirection, I think the whole argument hinges on one anecdote. It might indicate a general pattern, but no actual authoritative sources back it up. Original Article quotes "growing evidence suggests these stores are not merely a byproduct of economic distress. They’re a cause of it. In small towns and urban neighborhoods alike, dollar stores are triggering the closure of grocery stores, e…

Interesting. Do you know if Dollar General is cheaper per calorie when talking actual ready made meals? The linked article talks about worse price per ounce, which might mean something very different.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#72

Post by hogFeast »

helsinkiandrew wrote: post #4

Good article and discussion about the economics of these "Leeches of the poor": https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27650477 TLDR: The products in Dollar Stores aren't 'cheap' in the sense that they cost less than other stores per unit - its just that they're (mostly) packaged into smaller units that people living paycheck to paycheck can afford.

The reason smaller stuff is slightly more expensive is shipping costs. Compare two identical products in any store, the larger one will be cheaper, the smaller one will be more expensive, and this scales with weight.

TLDR: people who have never worked in retail, don't understand retail.

Also, saying that these stores are more expensive is crazy if you actually lived at a time when these stores didn't exist. These stores grew because production moved offshore for many products, and retailers took all that profit to their bottom-line (and the five layers of distributors). A lot of these chains cut this out and returned that profit to the consumer. Ofc, the product composition of each store is different (the ones with more FMCG do more optimisation of store size, range of products)...but yes, it turns out people will complain about lower prices...loudly (I have seen this in almost every country where similar formats exist, the loudness of the people complaining about low prices outweighs everything else).

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#73

Post by Afforess »

jcims wrote: post #37
ybean wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your example is already biased, because you use Walmart as the other option. Walmart already came through and blew away the local mom and pop market in these rural areas. Are they more convenient than driving an hour to a walmart? probably. I've seen small family run stores go out of business specifically because they can't compete with a dollar general that opened a mile away. "Deeply beneficial" seems like a strong…

Dollar General is wildly successful because they are filling a need.

No, not usually. Usually they are replacing a less profitable, but larger grocery store with a highly profitable, smaller dollar store. It's a greater profit at the cost of product selection.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#74

Post by lotsofpulp »

MattGaiser wrote: post #34
jcims wrote: post #16

It's not clear to me what the problem is that the article is outlining. The Dollar General near me has the exact same brands as you would find in any larger retail establishment, they just have found a way to stock the 80% that folks typically need. They are filling a niche between the gas station convenience store and traditional grocery/big box retail. They don't have a produce section, just a bit of fruit. Is that…

The problem as I understand it is that products aren’t priced in a grocery store to all have the same margin. So the prepared foods and toiletries get marked up to make up for low margins on fresh fruit. Wealthier customers are fine with this as they want to not have to make two trips and they will pay for the fruit. Dollar stores ditch the fresh stuff and just take a lower margin on the toiletries and prepared food…

The root problem is the populace being too poor to afford fresh fruit. Blaming dollar stores is a waste of time.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#75

Post by mumblemumble »

tspike wrote: post #61
mumblemumble wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a part of me that wants to push back against this idea that fresh produce is synonymous with good nutrition. Frozen produce - which the dollar stores in my area do carry - tends to be more nutritious nowadays. It is also much easier to prepare, and, assuming you have access to a freezer, is less susceptible to spoilage. And if your food preparation options don't amount to much more than a microwave oven, or y…

It's worth pointing out the difference between frozen produce (which, as you say, is nutritionally sound) and frozen TV dinners, which often contain multiple times the daily recommended intake of sodium and typically have miniscule portions of vegetables.

Sure. But, if you lack the ability to make good use of frozen produce, then that maybe isn't a realistic option, anyway. Then you might be looking at something more like a choice between TV dinner and McDonald's.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#76

Post by Retric »

sokoloff wrote: post #59
safog wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After a couple of levels of indirection, I think the whole argument hinges on one anecdote. It might indicate a general pattern, but no actual authoritative sources back it up. Original Article quotes "growing evidence suggests these stores are not merely a byproduct of economic distress. They’re a cause of it. In small towns and urban neighborhoods alike, dollar stores are triggering the closure of grocery stores, e…

Dollar General comes in and offers local consumers a bargain that local consumers strongly prefer. Accordingly, local consumers vote with their feet. Unless the master plan is to run competitors out of town and then change to "Two Dollar General", it seems like Dollar General is good for consumers (at least if you judge by consumers' own revealed preferences).

Dollar general does frequently have a high markup in poor communities without alternatives. It’s for lack of a better term poverty optimized which counterintuitively isn’t about the lowest cost per pound of flour etc.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#77

Post by jcims »

Afforess wrote: post #73
jcims wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dollar General is wildly successful because they are filling a need.

No, not usually. Usually they are replacing a less profitable, but larger grocery store with a highly profitable, smaller dollar store. It's a greater profit at the cost of product selection.

Not around here. They are showing up where there is no retail as well.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#78

Post by freemint »

mumblemumble wrote: post #51
gameswithgo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When dollar stores replace grocery stores in a community it reduces the quality of nutrition available. Potential vicious cycle there. Economic downturn --> worse nutrition -> decline in mental and physical health of community -> more downturn

There's a part of me that wants to push back against this idea that fresh produce is synonymous with good nutrition. Frozen produce - which the dollar stores in my area do carry - tends to be more nutritious nowadays. It is also much easier to prepare, and, assuming you have access to a freezer, is less susceptible to spoilage. And if your food preparation options don't amount to much more than a microwave oven, or y…

> There's a part of me that wants to push back against this idea that fresh produce is synonymous with good nutrition.

Whether the causality chain is over fresh produce or not. It is established fact that when a dollar store causes the close local grocers the nutrition and health of the local population suffers. On source for that would be Dr. Barry Popkin from University of North Carolina in this interview by CBS Monday morning https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtAvJBAJfnE

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#79

Post by sokoloff »

Retric wrote: post #76
sokoloff wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dollar General comes in and offers local consumers a bargain that local consumers strongly prefer. Accordingly, local consumers vote with their feet. Unless the master plan is to run competitors out of town and then change to "Two Dollar General", it seems like Dollar General is good for consumers (at least if you judge by consumers' own revealed preferences).

Dollar general does frequently have a high markup in poor communities without alternatives. It’s for lack of a better term poverty optimized which counterintuitively isn’t about the lowest cost per pound of flour etc.

If Dollar General is not in that neighborhood that has limited choice (or DG closes down/pulls out), is that community made better or worse? I think it's made worse.

Re: Dollar stores make up nearly half of all new store openings in the U.S.

#80

Post by mgkimsal »

shagmin wrote: post #64
jcims wrote: post #16

It's not clear to me what the problem is that the article is outlining. The Dollar General near me has the exact same brands as you would find in any larger retail establishment, they just have found a way to stock the 80% that folks typically need. They are filling a niche between the gas station convenience store and traditional grocery/big box retail. They don't have a produce section, just a bit of fruit. Is that…

I don't think Dollar General is the bad guy so much as a symptom of a problem. As it is, they're often in low income areas and have a high markup. Grocery stores have low margins that prevent them from entering these markets (hence food deserts). Dollar General fills that niche - but as a result low income people who already spend a disproportionate amount of their income on groceries have to pay that higher markup a…

outside of 'food deserts', there may be other factors people shop at DG. There's one a block from my office, and I drop in there now and then to get stuff (snacks, or light bulbs, or whatever). Almost every time I'm in there, I'll see an older person doing what seems to be a weekly shop (or more) - they'll ring up $70+ of stuff - canned/packaged foods. Clearly stuff for meals. They then get in to a taxi or rideshare car and are driven away.

.7 miles from here - in a more convenient area to drive to, is a Lidl, with everything that person bought about 40% cheaper. 1 mile away there's a Wegmans. 1.4 miles away there's Target, Lowes, and Harris Teeter. All just as accessible via taxi/uber as this DG.

The only real thing I can think of in DG's favor is it's very easy in/out - there's 2 counters, no self-checkout, the store is small itself. Just walking around to find what you want in those other stores would take 3-4x as long as hitting the 6 aisles in DG.

But... they're paying a terribly high price for that little bit of convenience. There's been a couple of times I've wanted to tell that person "hey, you can save $20 or more by driving another 3 minutes down the street" but I doubt it would be welcomed. I can't think of a way to intrude that isn't intrusive or patronizing. :/

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