Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era • Hacker News Board

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#221

Post by arthurcolle » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:10 PM UTC

sparker72678 wrote: post #211

ditonal wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the opposite. A decade ago, it was pretty much Google, Facebook, and some elite trading firms that could pay a ton. Now so many startups have grown up, there’s a huge list of them on levels.FYI that will pay 400k+ for senior and 600k+ for staff. I recently have interviewed for a ton and got rejected a bunch, but I joked with my spouse that there’s so many that by the time you’re done interviewing at all of the…

Omg I need to up my reqs in my interviews.

Yes. Ask for 620 though, then they come back at 575 and you just minted half of a 150k salary for being shrewd hehe

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#222

Post by the_only_law » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:11 PM UTC

sirmike_ wrote: post #218

the_only_law wrote: post #100

I hate that the market is so great right now because I really can’t take advantage of it. I would love to start the process, to try and get a salary increase anywhere from 30%-100% but unfortunately I’ve stagnated sharply skills wise. Don’t qualify for the jobs I see I think I’d enjoy, and don’t even qualify for the jobs that meet my salary preferences that I’d otherwise dislike. I also would have to be looking at im…

Why are you saying crazy self-fulfilling prophesies? Do you hate money? Take the leap into something you WANT. Skills, Sschmills! You can learn can't you? Life means learning new stuff all the time. Learning never takes a time out. The military was a bastion of learned lessons for me. One key takeaway: You are your own best advocate. Everything in an interview or negotiation related to you springs from that viewpoint…

> Take the leap into something you WANT. Skills, Sschmills! You can learn can't you?

It’s just about time really. I could skill up but what’s the market going to look like by the point I’m ready.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#223

Post by dh303 » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:11 PM UTC

gigatexal wrote: post #75

This sucks. I’m finally at a company that I like with a team that I like but I KNOW I am underpaid compared to what the market is paying. And yet I know I should be looking elsewhere.

Sometimes it’s not worth it, especially if you’re with a good company/team.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#224

Post by aleksiy » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:11 PM UTC

throwawaysleep wrote: post #19

dbish wrote: post #4

Even if you think you’re well paid, now is the time to look around. I’ve had a lot of friends, mentees, and coworkers get huge bumps on total compensation even as relatively senior engineers and managers. Pay is jumping and companies aren’t doing a great job keeping that up for their people who have been around for a few years. As an employer, that should be the top worry, keep comp up, don’t lose your people because…

For those of you who have done this, how do you maximise your compensation? Tips appreciated.

Just to add my own data point. I studied leetcode for 6 months during covid. Sent about 30 applications interviewed at 10 companies and received 8 offers.

2 of these offers where double my current TC through negotiation. It's not just FAANG but startups making very good offers. I have 3 YOE.

For negotiation:

Always ask for at least 20% more + a signing bonus

Have competing offers

Interview well

Be willing to walk away. If they can't do it there's another company that will.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#225

Post by MattGaiser » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:14 PM UTC

rubicon33 wrote: post #216

mmaunder wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly this. We just gave all our devs a significant raise - way above the norm, and way way earlier than we would. We're acknowledging the reality of demand, scarcity and wage inflation. My co-founder (also my wife) and I immediately felt our blood pressure drop once we did that. Market conditions are making it hard to retain and very hard to hire. We've done a bunch of other stuff to recruit - which I described in…

Kudos for doing the right thing. I hope (and expect) that for you and your business, it is the right thing. Hopefully those devs are quite skilled, and worth keeping around, and will stay and help the business grow! I feel like a lot of times employers think devs are expendable, and while that's true to some extent, devs also can be quite worth paying extra to keep around especially if they've accrued quite a lot of…

A past organization of mine just had a big data breach. It would not surprise me if the near complete loss of domain knowledge and institutional knowledge was a contributing factor/cause.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#226

Post by the_only_law » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:15 PM UTC

lostcolony wrote: post #34

throwawaysleep wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those of you who have done this, how do you maximise your compensation? Tips appreciated.

Ask for it. Seriously. I interviewed with one company, things went well, I was interested, but they came out of the gate with total comp that was lower than I was looking for. They were looking at a stock grant of X over 4 years. That would have worked, provided that I was basically guaranteed a refresher each year for X (so that by year 4 I'd making X per year in RSUs). I found out that refreshers were usually not f…

I learned to ask for things just a bit too late. For my current role, the job description explicitly noted there would be no relocation assistance. I ended up paying for my move out of pocket.

They were actually looking for two people for the role I was applying to. After starting, I met the other guy that was hired a few months before me. He had moved from even further than I had. After talking, he mentioned he was given relocation assistance. When I asked him about the explicit mention that that would not be offered. He simply told me he noticed it, but asked anyway and got it.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#227

Post by tcbumperino » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:15 PM UTC

gavinray wrote: post #214

JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I told myself I'd be fine at 300k. Now I'm there, and I've picked up more hobbies. Doesn't stop me from looking for new gigs, from time to time. Going super deep into optimizing for one thing might be a good short-term, but bad long-term proposition. A lot of getting to 700k, I imagine, is luck. So long as you're competent, it's right place, right time. You can't force that situation to happen, so it's wasted energy…

You would abandon your company and current position for a slight pay increase? Do you not actually care about the company you work for and you're just there for the pay? You make so much money already -- what is the thought process here Man imagine trying to hire people and knowing they would all leave in a heartbeat for a slight pay increase. What ever happened to working somewhere because you believe in what you're…

Imagine caring about your employer who employs 100k+ other people and who would fire you without hesitation. (Or glee even.)

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#228

Post by bredren » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:15 PM UTC

the_only_law wrote: post #168

gavinray wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even in FAANG I have a hard time understanding how any developer is worth that amount of money though. I know a solid number of FAANG and ex-FAANG devs -- the stuff they work on (from what I've heard) isn't much different from the sorts of software I assume most people in SaaS startups work on. Outside of scale (which is significant). A lot of it is internal tooling though, which never hits absurd amounts of scale. I…

I think with FAANG it’s mostly just down to them having insane valuation and being able to give out those stock options. The base salaries don’t seem particularly high, until maybe the highest levels.

Yes. When I hear a valley person mention salary, they usually bundle in stock compensation.

The cash and other benefits are still ludicrous by any normal assessment but stock makes it unreal.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#229

Post by spike021 » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:16 PM UTC

chronic2703 wrote: post #14

rejectedandsad wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have FAANG on my resume and this is definitely not the case lol. Then again, it’s Amazon which most people regard to have the dumbest engineers so…

Amazon is absolutely a red flag on the resume. Many hiring managers (like myself) do not want to import the toxic, backstabbing, PIP culture from Amazon into our org. Also I’ve noticed the quality of Amazon engineers is lower, on average, compared to Google, ByteDance, FB, Stripe, etc. My advice is to work somewhere not-Amazon for a year or two. Then you’ll get more bites.

Is this true?

Since joining Amazon 2 years ago the rate of recruiters hitting my inbox has increased around 3x and I regularly get contacts from Google, Facebook, and MS recruiters, plus recruiters from random small shops in the Bay Area.

I suppose you are exaggerating.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#230

Post by lostcolony » Sun, Aug 01, 2021, 10:16 PM UTC

the_only_law wrote: post #226

lostcolony wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ask for it. Seriously. I interviewed with one company, things went well, I was interested, but they came out of the gate with total comp that was lower than I was looking for. They were looking at a stock grant of X over 4 years. That would have worked, provided that I was basically guaranteed a refresher each year for X (so that by year 4 I'd making X per year in RSUs). I found out that refreshers were usually not f…

I learned to ask for things just a bit too late. For my current role, the job description explicitly noted there would be no relocation assistance. I ended up paying for my move out of pocket. They were actually looking for two people for the role I was applying to. After starting, I met the other guy that was hired a few months before me. He had moved from even further than I had. After talking, he mentioned he was…

Expensive lesson, but a useful one. A good candidate who is willing to sign is too valuable to pass on just because they're asking for 5-20k in one time expenses.

Even if they stuck with no relo, they might have extra budget for sign on, which is equivalent. For whatever reason, companies tend to be sticklers for budget allocation, even if total amount equates, even to their bottom line. Relocation assistance might be frowned on as an 'unnecessary' overhead cost ("can we not find good people already in the area?!"), but a higher sign on wouldn't ("it's a competitive market"), despite also being overhead.