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Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

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Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#151

Post by DangitBobby »

RandomLensman wrote: post #147
DangitBobby wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Short term pleasure is not wrong. The entire premise boils down to the belief that the 40 hour work-week means you are sacrificing long-term and short-term pleasure for superficial short-term pleasure, and that the inherent dissatisfaction arising from the arrangement is the only thing supporting the economy and resulting lifestyles as they exist, perpetuating dissatisfaction, for, practically, the sake of dissatisfa…

Let me put it this way: people have been spending on pleasure since ancient times (including people without any need to work). So that type of economy has existed for a long time. The sacrificed long-term pleasure seems rather mythical to me and very different from person to person.

I think free time allows you to seek long term pleasure. That was my experience when I was younger, penniless, relatively un-obligated, and much more free. I would (and do) describe my current 9-5 existence as largely joyless.

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#152

Post by RandomLensman »

hoseja wrote: post #150
RandomLensman wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, why is short-term pleasure wrong? My life would not be improved by less money, by the way. More free time, yes, fewer purchases, not necessarily.

Well for one, because it's very inefficient.

Why would efficiency be a relevant measure for how to live my life?

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#153

Post by Animats »

Weak article. Mostly virtue signaling.

Yes, your lifestyle was once "designed". That probably peaked in the late 1950s. See "American Look". [1] That's the high point of industrial design. Also the era of tailfins. That was when the US first had far much manufacturing capacity than it really needed.

As for fashion, go watch this clip from The Devil Wears Prada.[2]

All this used to be coordinated from New York, when Madison Avenue and the Manhattan garment district had real power. Now it's much more random, with manufacturers struggling to keep up with trends, rather than dictating them.

[1] https://archive.org/details/american_look

[2] https://youtu.be/KqaOY6al-ZQ

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#154

Post by lwhi »

ilamont wrote: post #5

Western economies, particularly that of the United States, have been built in a very calculated manner on gratification, addiction, and unnecessary spending. Calculated, like in planned-economy, directive-from-the-top? I disagree. A lot of the "fluff," as the author describes it, is excess capital finding its way to things people find pleasurable, whether it be dope, travel, beauty, or rock and roll. Purveyors of suc…

> Purveyors of such pleasures have proved to be remarkably adept at creating & providing these opportunities.

It feels like this was also the central point the author was making, although they made it more forcefully.

.. these purveyors aren't necessarily 'providing these opportunities'; they are actually the inventors of many of the pleasures in the first instance.

It's not a calculated directive from the top. It's a crystallised consensus from those in a position of influence. Incentive based capitalism, at it's worst (or best, depending on your point of view).

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#155

Post by RandomLensman »

DangitBobby wrote: post #151
RandomLensman wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me put it this way: people have been spending on pleasure since ancient times (including people without any need to work). So that type of economy has existed for a long time. The sacrificed long-term pleasure seems rather mythical to me and very different from person to person.

I think free time allows you to seek long term pleasure. That was my experience when I was younger, penniless, relatively un-obligated, and much more free. I would (and do) describe my current 9-5 existence as largely joyless.

Fair enough. I tend to feel most free with a lot of resources at my disposal and just enjoying my life and the world. And I'd agree that a lot of work is joyless. I think the difference is more that I tend to enjoy things "locally" and not "globally".

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#156

Post by pharmakom »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #138
ilamont wrote: post #5

Western economies, particularly that of the United States, have been built in a very calculated manner on gratification, addiction, and unnecessary spending. Calculated, like in planned-economy, directive-from-the-top? I disagree. A lot of the "fluff," as the author describes it, is excess capital finding its way to things people find pleasurable, whether it be dope, travel, beauty, or rock and roll. Purveyors of suc…

Debt is >60% of the economy, and it's price fixed. It's interesting that people seem to think fixing the price of bananas has more consequence than fixing the price of debt.

How is it price fixed? Interest rates go up and down, different lenders offer different terms, etc.

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#157

Post by visarga »

burlesona wrote: post #62
ProjectArcturis wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just wait till you have kids. You'll look back on this time as a paradise of freedom.

I wouldn’t say “paradise” of freedom. Definitely more flexibility without kids, but kids bring so much joy and meaning to life. For most people it’s a very worthwhile trade.

"All Joy and No Fun"

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#158

Post by Animats »

captainmuon wrote: post #13
ilamont wrote: post #5

Western economies, particularly that of the United States, have been built in a very calculated manner on gratification, addiction, and unnecessary spending. Calculated, like in planned-economy, directive-from-the-top? I disagree. A lot of the "fluff," as the author describes it, is excess capital finding its way to things people find pleasurable, whether it be dope, travel, beauty, or rock and roll. Purveyors of suc…

Counterpoint: What do you think "fashion" is? I used to think there were some very cool, fashion-adept people, who have the ability to predict what will considered modern next year. The reality is, the clothing industry decides what to produce at least 6-12 months in advance. It's not like they produce everything and public opinion decides in the end what is "cool". Granted, the industry tries to predict what will be…

When they say "blue will be in fashion next year"

"They" being the Color Association of the United States.[1] Which had a lot more clout when the US made its own textiles.

They also used to manage the consumer electronics color cycle, from grey to black to white to colors to putty and back to grey again.

[1] https://www.colorassociation.com/

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#159

Post by criddell »

SavantIdiot wrote: post #87
criddell wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> shelling out $30 to rent My family of four can pay $30 + grocery store food costs to have dinner and a movie or we can pay around $100 to go see a movie and have dinner at Alamo. $30 is a bargain.

You're proving my point: that same film is $100 in the cinema. $100!! But the Overton window pushed you into thinking $30 is a bargain . You think that wasn't intentional?

How isn't it a bargain?

Re: Your Lifestyle Has Already Been Designed (2010)

#160

Post by scarecrowbob »

namdnay wrote: post #135
anemoiac wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Oh lord, being “forced” to provide work in order to receive the work of others I didn't write the comment you responded to, but I don't think its author was advocating for the mythical "free lunch." I read their comment as a statement decrying the seemingly artificial constraints built into modern (American, I presume) society that force workers to make an essentially binary choice between a stable, secure life and…

But how is that binary choice artificial? You’d have exactly the same choice 10000 years ago. Either go and hunt and forage for food, or starve

I mean, I'm living near a concentration camp for folks who were doing that.

Some folks fenced everything off, hunted the large animals to death, and re-educated the children.

There really isn't a choice, or at least if there is, I've seen what the US did to the folks choosing that choice, and it wasn't pretty.

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