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Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

arstechnica.com

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Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#181

Post by closeparen »

youeseh wrote: post #144
closeparen wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it selfish that someone expects me to treat them like a teammate when they can’t be bothered to show up.

What does "show up" mean when the technology allows you to "show up", and fulfill all of a job's requirements remotely?

What does “team” mean when the technology allows you to build perfectly good software by exchanging short, on-topic, asynchronous messages with a rotating cast of anonymous strangers?

I don’t think it’s necessary to be physically present to build software, but if you do go remote, go all the way. Trying to build a sense of camaraderie over Zoom is a tragic farce.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#182

Post by edem »

vhold wrote: post #4

I wonder how much of it is driven by the company leadership owning very expensive real estate that would lose a lot of value once tech workers are not forced to spend money into those rental or real estate markets.

I'm 95% sure that most of those companies have 5+ year contracts they can't cancel so they will keep trying to force people into the office.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#183

Post by edem »

zxcvbn4038 wrote: post #122

Working remotely turned out to be the perk I never knew I wanted. I get back 3-4 hours a day that I would spend commuting, I have much better options for food at home, I get to see a lot more of my wife then I used to. And it makes sense - all of the infrastructure I work with is in the cloud, I haven’t had to roll out a crash cart in a data center in a decade. Almost everyone I work with is overseas, I don’t need to…

You can move there without telling anyone. For example I live in the same house on paper where I was living 16 years ago. No one cares and no one will go and check if you live there. I'm pretty sure you can make this work.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#185

Post by dntrkv »

toptal wrote: post #48

I’ve written about this extensively https://www.toptal.com/insights/future-of-work/remote-not-re... The problem is they built campuses and feel stupid about devaluing them. Combine that with a backwards mindset and, for most companies, the situation becomes clear. It’s really that simple.

There is no way any of the FANG companies care about keeping their campuses occupied for the sole purpose of justifying their costs. If remote work resulted in happier employees and by extension more productive employees that trade-off would be a no-brainer. The real reason is they genuinely think in-person benefits outweigh remote benefits for most employees. The internal employee surveys show this to be the case. Most employees want the hybrid model. HN is a bubble.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#186

Post by whateveracct »

jonathankoren wrote: post #164
MattGaiser wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am defining “relationship” more broadly to encompass all my human (and dog in my case) relationships. I am not humblebragging about optimization. I have 24 hours in a day. They are generally all spoken for, meaning that for something to go in, something else must go out.

You said you were young, so let this old person give you some advice. If you think interacting with coworkers is opposed to being a productive employee, you’re gravely mistaken. Also if you think you need to optimally schedule every day to maximize work, you need to rethink your life.

> If you think interacting with coworkers is opposed to being a productive employee

Being productive is as much a waste of my time as interacting with coworkers.

I basically have every day mostly free because I'm just productive Enough and work remote. I am leaving an insane amount of (for-employer) productivity on the table and instead giving myself that productivity.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#187

Post by jonathankoren »

sharken wrote: post #177
jonathankoren wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The corporation isn’t mandating what happens to your body any more than the government is (as long as there isn’t forced injections). They’re simply choosing not to associate with un vaccinated people. This is first amendment from both sides all the way. It’s literally no different from not wanting to employ people that don’t have a driver’s license, or some credential, or are convicted of crimes.

So i must agree to disagree then, none of the examples mentioned require you to make changes to your body.

Then you need to read it again. No one is making you make changes to your body. You are always free to go somewhere else.

Come on. If vaccines are ao offensive, why do you want to work for someone that only wants people that are vaccinated around them? Take some responsibility for your life choices instead crying, “Woe is me!” No one owes you a job, nor do you owe any employer your labor. Walk if you don’t like it.

Finally, if you think employers and body modification is some recent bridge too far, perhaps you should google tattoos, hair styles, facial hair, and piercings in the workplace.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#188

Post by 3gg »

NonContro wrote: post #170
3gg wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the link, but I'm not sure about the conclusion. Why do you think the company would reimburse you for $3500/mo for freeing up office space or using less of it? A company basically pays you for your cost of living. That's why pay is high in the Bay Area or NY, and why you take a massive pay cut when you move out. If you choose to work remotely or sign up for shitty work conditions, they are not going to rei…

Companies pay you minimum you're willing to accept. People don't have a habit of accepting jobs they know will cause their personal budgets to run red.

That is indeed a more accurate statement.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#189

Post by chaostheory »

abz10 wrote: post #103
Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No-poach stuff? There are literally millions of companies that allow remote work, are they all part of the no-poach cartel?

Some tech jobs are only available in a handful of companies that were a part of the cartel. Some of us took the bet that a big investment in education in one of these specialties would pay off. The cartel effectively suppressed the pay off. Now these companies are complaining that the supply of specialists has dried up.

With recent limits on H1B, those companies aren’t wrong to say that the supply has dried up. That said, it means we have more leverage when it comes to remote work. If it means changing companies, so be it.

Re: Big tech companies are at war with employees over remote work

#190

Post by youeseh »

closeparen wrote: post #181
youeseh wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does "show up" mean when the technology allows you to "show up", and fulfill all of a job's requirements remotely?

What does “team” mean when the technology allows you to build perfectly good software by exchanging short, on-topic, asynchronous messages with a rotating cast of anonymous strangers? I don’t think it’s necessary to be physically present to build software, but if you do go remote, go all the way. Trying to build a sense of camaraderie over Zoom is a tragic farce.

My team is distributed around the US. A number of people joined after the pandemic started, which forced the firm to go from fully in-house to fully-remote overnight.

Our experience is that a team that works together to solve problems builds camaraderie. The tools and tech are all there and very easy and affordable.

A few weeks ago we met up for lunch after being away from each other for over a year. Nothing about our meeting gave us the impression that we'd grown apart from working remotely.

Of course, the size of your investment and your returns may vary.

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