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The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

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Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#201

Post by ceejayoz »

da_big_ghey wrote: post #172
ceejayoz wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've heard a lot of negative stories about the British health system including people waiting 6+ months to see doctors... The wait time for an American at the poverty line seeking care for an expensive but non-emergency chronic condition can be effectively infinite . My wife receives treatment for chronic pain. Getting treatment at a pain clinic started required five visits (including being able to physically get t…

partially fault of stringent regulation on pain medication because often it is consisting of controlled substance. bad penalties if doctor is not careful enough about giving to anybody.

It's an example, but it's hardly unique to pain treatment. Any specialist is going to bill out at a couple hundred bucks for a quick visit, and might be scheduling 3-6 months out; that's entirely your financial responsibility if you haven't met your deductible.

Anything that requires ongoing treatments or regular doctors' visits is going to be largely inaccessible to a low-income person on a high-deductible plan.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#202

Post by Y_Y »

hef19898 wrote: post #95
Y_Y wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a big fan of universal healthcare, and have made great use of both public and private hospitals in Europe and the US. Everywhere I've lived (except the US) has had a totally free public system, and every time I've still paid for private insurance. I'm not rich by any means, and I don't have any particularly special requirements. I'm not even looking for better doctors or machines, since they are mostly shared or…

The countries I have direct experience with, France and Germany, don't have any issues with people dying while waiting for procedures. Experts are usually readily available, so there are exceptions. I don't know of any public health care system in developed countries that have really these issues. I do know so, that a lot of that comes from a PR campaign run by US insurances against the Canadian system.

When you say they don't have any issues, do you mean it doesn't happen?

I'm more familiar with the Spanish, Irish and UK systems. I tried to find a nice document giving numbers for what I was describing, but most of what I can find is anecdotal, and the official reports are weren't quantitative.

Here's an article from an Irish newspaper last year that gives a rough guess (though of course there are other factors): https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/are-patient-waiting-l...

I'm certainly open to US insurance companies paying me to shill on hn against Canadian healthcare, but right now I'm only saying these things out of the goodness of my heart.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#203

Post by spaetzleesser »

wil421 wrote: post #86
rakmos wrote: post #52

This hits home for me.. my son (now 4 years old) was born very premature at 29 weeks and some change. He spent 7 weeks and 4 days in the NICU. The total hospital bill that was charged to insurance (before settling it between themselves) was roughly 960_000$. If you include the additional services and whatnot in the few months following being discharged from the hospital he was a million dollar baby. Complete insanity…

The billing system is a complete farce. Here’s a large made up number for the total bill, ok here’s another large number because we like your insurance, and finally here’s what your insurance actually paid. My wife had complications the first time and the total bill was like $35k, insurance paid $9k, and our cost was $0. We actually got our $250 admission back. Nobody pays the made of number from the first bill not e…

“Nobody pays the made of number from the first bill not even the uninsured.”

This is maybe true but the actual number you pay is a total gamble depending on whatever the hospital feels like they can discount this month, whatever loopholes the insurance has found for not paying, whatever hoops the insurance or hospital have set up and you have jumped through correctly or not and how much time you have for the next few months or years to fight the bill.

It’s a totally insane and arbitrary system. Probably the pinnacle of a large and unaccountable bureaucracy. Sometimes I wonder if dealing with the mob is a more straightforward and reliable thing vs going to a hospital.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#204

Post by spaetzleesser »

dexterdog wrote: post #115
swashboon wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

availability, coverage, cost

Um, not cost.

Yeah, they forgot the cost part. It probably didn’t help that the republicans did whatever they could do to kill ACA instead of trying to improve it.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#205

Post by xtracto »

CountDrewku wrote: post #127
inglor wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Israel we have public healthcare. I was born at week 32 and spent about 6 weeks in the NICU - everything was free. It's not always great and I do pay for private insurance in case I need something urgent - but everything emergency is absolutely covered. I believe it's this state in most developed places that are not the US?

Everything was not free, you just didn't pay directly for it while you were at the hospital. I don't understand why the word free always gets thrown around for country's with socialized medicine. You are paying for it.

This American fixation with the word "free" always makes me chuckle. Aa when a bus driver in Las Vegas got angry when I asked them if thag was the "free" bus, and he angrily replied "it's not free, its complimentary " .

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#206

Post by sumtechguy »

100011_100001 wrote: post #26
chadash wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you have a percentage copay, say 10%, they will tell you to pay $25k because it's 10%, but they might only pay $75k. In this example you clearly paid 25% but they tell you it's only 10%. I think this is coinsurance, not copay. Copay is the $50 (or whatever) flat fee you pay every time you see a specialist. Coinsurance is a percentage of costs that you share with the insurance company, up to some maximum out of p…

A lot of insurance companies will have a 10-20% coinsurance for hospital visits, not a traditional co-pay like you went to a specialist. That 10-20% goes against the deductible, so depending on the bill you might not even pay the full 10% because it hits your deductible max. Edit: I was informed that it's not 10% co-pay but coinsurance. So I updated my post to reflect that.

That is highly dependent on what your plan is.

Some plans are flat co pay. Some are percentage. Some are mixed. Some max out at particular amounts, some dont depending on the care you are doing.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#207

Post by craftinator »

arethuza wrote: post #182
CountDrewku wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything was not free, you just didn't pay directly for it while you were at the hospital. I don't understand why the word free always gets thrown around for country's with socialized medicine. You are paying for it.

Free in this context clearly means "free at the point of delivery" - we all know we pay for it in our taxes.

But in the case of the US, we pay for healthcare in our taxes, pay again as companies, and again pay co-pays as individuals.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#208

Post by [deleted] »

mrits wrote: post #165
skeletal88 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The obligatory comment about how crazy this is on many levels. 1. You are being charged prices that you are not expected to pay, but need to negotiate on 2. When you go to a doctor to have a procedure or have an emergency then you don't know what you are paying. In normal countries there is A price list, which is THE price list for all hospitals that are part of the national health care system. If they want to have a…

Before you get too upset you should realize that OP was incorrect.

[deleted]

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#209

Post by zikduruqe »

wilde wrote: post #83
enriquec wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By what metric have things gotten better since the ACA?

Medical bankruptcies. https://www.colorado.edu/today/2020/04/30/affordable-care-ac...

I filed for bankruptcy about 10 years ago due to a family member's medical bills. Funny, a year afterwards, when establishing credit again, all the financial institutions were like "yep, no problem, it happens".

24 months later, credit was back to normal-ish, bought new car, financed new home, and no medical debt.

Re: The cost of two weeks in an pediatric/infant ICU

#210

Post by cloudfifty »

marcinzm wrote: post #173
cloudfifty wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it is ethical to keep the lines shorter by excluding the poor?

No but that wasn't the question the OP asked. Unless you've got a nation of saints the majority of people will make somewhat selfish decisions.

And for most citizens of developed countries that selfishness translates to universal health care. No need to worry.
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