Earlier quoted context omitted.
okay. i’ll bite. what’s the “real” truth?
That nobody knows the real truth, duh
Sure, that’s right. But how do we find out who is less confused?
Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
131–140 of 722 posts
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
And your point is? No one is strapping down Google employees to a chair to inject them with a vaccine. They are free not to take it if they chose to do so, and accept the consequences of their actions like any adult would.
I'd classify 'get an experimental vaccine with known possibility of side effects or we fire you from your job' as 'element of force', 'duress', and 'coercion'. Am I to understand that you would not?
You know, you make a good point.
I think the problem with your argument is equating the covid vaccine to medical experimentation as considered in the Nuremberg Code. That code was written as the result of the Nazi experimentation of human subjects. The covid vaccine is technically experimental under the FDA definition only because it hasn't received full approval yet, but it has already gone through trials that (to some extent) have proved its safety. I don't think "medical experiment" has used in the code is the same as in the case of the covid vaccine as of today.
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#133Earlier quoted context omitted.
As of now, everyone, included the vaccinated are still disease spreaders.
Vaccines not cutting transmission in 100% are still a poor reason to not have everyone vaccinated. Anti-vaxxers pretend they worry about the ones who can't get vaccinated when they're actually who makes things unsafer for them
Please don't take HN threads into tedious flamewar on eternal flamewar topics.
We've had to ask you about this countless times. Would you please just stop?
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#134All: please don't take HN threads into tedious flamewar on eternal flamewar topics. "Vax versus antivax" is one of the most tedious of them all. If you're tempted to post angrily about how wrong and bad the other side is, please inhibit that impulse. If your comment was going to repeat something we've all heard many times before, please don't post it.
Obviously the vax theme is topical in this case—that makes this a good chance to apply discernment and distinguish between thoughtful, substantive comments and shallow, dismissive ones. As that is what we all should be doing on HN anyway, practice is good.
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is routine drug testing universally considered acceptable? If I'm going to be a pilot, maybe. For a developer job, I would never consider one that asked for a drug test (I don't use drugs just to be clear, my objection is to a company having any say in what people do on their own time). People complain about having to do a coding test during the interview process, but somehow it's ok to verify that you don't smoke po…
I've been drug tested for corporate programming jobs before. I wouldn't say it's the norm in our industry though and this may be even less common now, IDK. But I do feel like there's a distinction between a urine test and a vaccine, since it's impossible to have a negative reaction to a piss test. As a fully vaccinated individual, I still dislike the idea of having to disclose this fact. Not for any logical reason I…
If they can ask for your COVID vaccine status, they can ask for your other vaccines, your HIV status, they can ask for the results of your latest colonoscopy, your blood pressure, your blood sugar, all in the name of a "healthy workplace."
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#136Earlier quoted context omitted.
But if others are already vaccinated, how does an unvaccinated coworker infect a vaccinated coworker?
Vaccination doesn’t mean you cannot be infected, and cannot spread it once infected. It lowers the chances of infection and presentation of symptoms. So when your unvaccinated coworker exercises his selfish right to be stupid, you’re putting others at risk. The difference here is that your exposing your coworkers children and others who cannot be vaccinated to infection. We socially tolerate people like this who choo…
But we were told to get vaccinated to protect others. Get vaccinated so you can visit your grandparents. Now we are getting a different message. This is why people develop doubts that the authorities have any real idea what they are talking about.
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
Does this apply to the flu, varicella, meningitis, etc as well?
The vaccination rate for vericella (Chickenpox) is over 90%, so our society has herd immunity and cases are rare. Same with measles, mumps, diphtheria and polio. I don't know the vaccination for meningitis, but cases are rare and mostly in children not old enough to be vaccinated. If an officemate wanted to be a free rider on one of those they could, and it would be very unlikely any harm would come from it. If we ha…
> The vaccination rate for vericella (Chickenpox) is over 90%
Certainly not in the older generations. I never had a chickenpox vaccine. They didn't exist when I was a child. I have had chickenpox though.
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is routine drug testing universally considered acceptable? If I'm going to be a pilot, maybe. For a developer job, I would never consider one that asked for a drug test (I don't use drugs just to be clear, my objection is to a company having any say in what people do on their own time). People complain about having to do a coding test during the interview process, but somehow it's ok to verify that you don't smoke po…
I've been drug tested for corporate programming jobs before. I wouldn't say it's the norm in our industry though and this may be even less common now, IDK. But I do feel like there's a distinction between a urine test and a vaccine, since it's impossible to have a negative reaction to a piss test. As a fully vaccinated individual, I still dislike the idea of having to disclose this fact. Not for any logical reason I…
[deleted]
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’ve never had a job require me to prove those vaccines to come in.
They are required if you want to immigrate to the US [1], so I sure hope citizens-by-birth also have to follow similar rules. Maybe you don't need to prove anything because by default people would already either be vaccinated, or had to obtain an exemption? [1] https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-8-part-b-chapter-...
There are vaccines required to attend public school, but if your parents just say "I refuse" they are not going to kick you out. These hard-core antivaxxers are pretty small in number though.
Re: Google and Facebook mandate vaccines for employees at U.S. offices
#140It's honestly fascinating to me that this is going to be the way we meet Privacy vs Security face to face more broadly. Intrapersonally, they might go hand in hand, but in the group setting, they seem almost at direct odds. Security (or safety) requires some social contracts to be fulfilled. When these social contracts aren't enough we start to see polices and law take up the slack. Our existing privacy laws and regu…
HIPPA is absolutely not too strict, it has many fundamental holes which need to be plugged. I am vaccinated but the only place I am willing to prove it is at an airport or a medical facility. There is a developing liberty/security divide which is going very much in the direction of far too far. Going along with the irrational ways so many people talk about vaccination I am not willing to give up an inch of liberty to…
> HIPPA is absolutely not too strict, it has many fundamental holes which need to be plugged.
Citation needed? It’s HIPAA, by the way; one P and two As.
> There is a developing liberty/security divide which is going very much in the direction of far too far.
Total drivel. I’m sick of lockdowns and mask mandates. If you’re legally and medically eligible for a vaccine and you haven’t gotten one, I’m happy for private businesses to refuse you service.