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France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

sciencemag.org

241–250 of 305 posts

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#241
post #173

I remember hearing people arguing that the Covid lab leak hypothesis was implausible because of stringent safety measures.

The Covid lab leak hypothesis is primarily implausible because of Occam's razor.

That is not an argument. It is extremely plausible because the epidemic started next to the lab. Look at the size of China. Take a map of the country and throw a dart at it. Now consider the probability of it landing within 1 mm of Wuhan. Let's call this dart Occam's fléchette.

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The word "prion" is actually a contraction of the words "protein" and "infection". (edit: although I agree it's not what one might conventionally think of as an "infection")

Contraction or portmanteau?

Contraction :

A portmanteau word is similar to a contraction, but contractions are formed from words that would otherwise appear together in sequence, such as do and not to make don't, whereas a portmanteau is formed by combining two or more existing words that all relate to a single concept.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portmanteau

"Motel" and "fog" are portmanteaus, because you wouldn't put "motor hotel" or "smoke fog" in sentences that accept the accretions, whereas you could swap "prion" for "protein infection".

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#244
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Never been shown to” is the kind of false speak I keep hearing from the government and media. Just because you’ve never tried it doesn’t mean you have shown something.

There is a difference between "never been shown to" and "shown to never".

That was meant to be my point, the down vote makes me think I didn’t make it clearly enough…

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#245
post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Never been shown to” is the kind of false speak I keep hearing from the government and media. Just because you’ve never tried it doesn’t mean you have shown something.

"There is no evidence that..." is my recent favorite.

Yeah that’s been constant. There was ‘no evidence that delta variant is more dangerous’ for white a while, until there was actually some evidence to go on.

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#246

Hm: "long period of uncertainty began on 31 May 2010, when she stabbed her left thumb with a curved forceps while cleaning a cryostat—a machine that can cut tissues at very low temperatures—that she used to slice brain sections from transgenic mice infected with a sheep-adapted form of BSE . She pierced two layers of latex gloves and drew blood" Later in the article: ""We conduct research only on mouse-adapted sheep…

Keep in mind that the researcher was only 23 years old at the time when the lab accident happened. In some ways, she was basically a kid. As everyone knows, she ended up dying because of this.

A human has a fully developed adult brain around age 25, but for some people it is not until age 30 [1].

[1] https://bigthink.com/mind-brain/adult-brain?rebelltitem=1#re...

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#247

Hm: "long period of uncertainty began on 31 May 2010, when she stabbed her left thumb with a curved forceps while cleaning a cryostat—a machine that can cut tissues at very low temperatures—that she used to slice brain sections from transgenic mice infected with a sheep-adapted form of BSE . She pierced two layers of latex gloves and drew blood" Later in the article: ""We conduct research only on mouse-adapted sheep…

The full section with the Aguzzi quote adds context, including his declining to comment on the French case. > The scientific community has long recognized that handling prions is dangerous and an occupational risk for neuropathologists, says neuropathologist Adriano Aguzzi of the University of Zurich. Aguzzi declined to comment on the French CJD cases, but told Science his lab never handles human or bovine prions for…

We know that aerosoled brains of animals can cause disease in humans.

Take a look at this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_inflammatory_neu...

This disease was discovered due to an alert translator (most likely translating from Spanish to English) recalling that he had seen patients’ records before that had the nearly the same exact history.

After investigation, it was discovered the patients worked in a slaughterhouse near the pig brain section, where the brains were being aerosolized. Many ended up developing a progressive inflammatory neuropathy.

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#248
post #56

Prions are weird. I was at UCSF during the time they went from a fringe theory to an established fact and a nobel prize. The professor who studied them (Prusiner) had to overcome tons of resistance and the experiments were heroic (often waiting months for mice to die). It's really funny that everybody resisted it until somebody mentioned that there was a plausible physical mechanism of refolding catalysis.

> everybody resisted it until somebody mentioned that there was a plausible physical mechanism

This is a good instinct IMO. Experiments by one person can easily be nonsense, especially if you don't already know and trust that person. Without a physical mechanism, given extraordinary results, I would certainly remain skeptical.

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#249
post #49
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know, but it's a poor choice of word since it's nothing like viruses or bacteria.

Viruses are nothing like bacteria, so it doesn’t make any sense to restrict the term of “infection” to those two.

It is interesting though that we don't consider things like lead and radiation to be "infections".

Is the difference between an infection and poisoning replication?

Re: France issues moratorium on prion research after fatal brain disease strikes

#250
post #51

Kinda a morbid question but could you just sever the finger moments after the prick? Or would the blood pump so fast that the prion(s) is already in your body.

They mention in the article that normal protocol is to immediately soak the thumb in bleach. Not sure if that’s actually effective though, or just hopeful.

Wow be glad Trump didn't suggest that.
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