151–160 of 623 posts
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That I never got. You are a market leader and you just stop whatever you are doing? How did that happen? Arguably the biggest mistake of MS.
IE6 was wrapping up development when the US government sued to break up the whole company for giving it away with Windows. Perhaps not a coincidence they stopped work then?
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I suspect that developers are simply angry with Apple for not letting them to fiddle with the latest stuff that Google is experimenting with. Chrome is the new IE but with better manners if you consider the non standard Chrome specific stuff that makes websites to work only in Chrome. Developers hated IE for not being standart, you had to write two versions of your CSS, you had to make your code accommodate the Box m…
We are not angry about the lack of toys. We are angry about not having the possibility of using PWA as an app model. PWA are useless without Apple's support. My case was a WebBluetooth based download of data from a web page. Now I have to maintain two apps. Thanks.
Chrome and Android are very dominant platforms, if it is something groundbreaking that can be done in that model it would be done in Android and Chrome and Apple will adopt it. Google is not an underdog.
> Because IE was seriously outdated, lacking support for cutting-edge web APIs and technologies enabling the modern websites and web apps we use today. This is just false, or at best only half of the story to make a false equivalence. IE was cutting edge until Firefox. The biggest problem with IE was all the insanely weird shit it did, not missing features. It would “fix” missing tags, that would then be broken on ev…
I suspect that developers are simply angry with Apple for not letting them to fiddle with the latest stuff that Google is experimenting with. Chrome is the new IE but with better manners if you consider the non standard Chrome specific stuff that makes websites to work only in Chrome. Developers hated IE for not being standart, you had to write two versions of your CSS, you had to make your code accommodate the Box m…
That is absolute bullshit. Browser push notifications have been out for years on other browsers (INCLUDING desktop Safari), and they are the one thing that Apple is dragging their feet on the most because they know it's the most important thing that prevents a dev from just doing a PWA and instead has to do a native app.
This is absolutely Apple protecting their App Store monopoly.
A bigger issue which this site forgets to mention is the 7 day cap for local storage data after which the data is deleted unless the site haas been added to the Home Screen shortcut (the option for which has also been hidden in menus now without any API to present this easily): > Apple in its Full Third-Party Cookie Blocking and More blog post announced changes to WebKit that erases all local storage data for a given…
This whole thread seems to be full of Apple fans, you shouldn't point to any logically correct criticisms of Apple
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Safari is not only notorious for unimplemented features but also for unique (and often critical) bugs in spite of the shared origin with Chrome.
"shared origin with Chrome" You mean Chrome was a fork from Webkit when Google decided they could no longer play nice with Apple...
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>This is just false, or at best only half of the story to make a false equivalence. IE was cutting edge until Firefox. After developing during the IE 5.5/6 years there's no way I'm giving you a pass in calling IE cutting edge.
At the time IE 6 was released, it was the best browser available. The problem was Microsoft acted is they had “won” and stopped updating it for years, where it calcified and became the hot mess we all knew and disliked.
> Progressive web apps I don't want PWAs. Apparently Google is their biggest promoter and Chrome has the best PWA support but the apps still stuck. I prefer to leave them open in a Chrome tab than have it pop out and pretend to be a native app. So good on Safari to not support it properly, it does not provide any benefit at all. > Lagging support for WebRTC and other features Again, I don't care. Just write a native…
> Again, I don't care. Just write a native app if you want to do video/audio calls, or send/receive files. The worst native app for these purposes is better than the best WebRTC implementation. Google Meet and Jitsi are fantastic, in my opinion. Zoom however has had a constant parade of vulnerabilities over the last year.
If you look at the features that Apple lags on adding support for, usually it's either because: 1. they can be abused (PWAs) 2. are complex to implement (WebRTC – for the longest time the recommendation in the WebRTC community if you wanted to build a C++ app was to bundle a good chunk of Chrome's libraries) 3. or could be bad for battery (web workers) So yeah, it makes some developers' jobs harder but generally ther…
In what way can PWAs be abused?
That does not excuse Apple’s cavalier attitude towards bugs, but many of the APIs they refuse to implement deserve to die, like WebUSB or Bluetooth access, because of the privacy or security risks of weakening the browser sandbox. Has Google not learnt from the ActiveX fiasco?
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This isn’t an Apple vs Google thing. This is an Apple vs web standards thing. It’s actually and Apple vs. APIs and technologies that allow fingerprinting on the web thing. Nobody mentions that Mozilla has sided with Apple much of the time to not implement some of these same APIs and technologies.
Then apple should focus on improving the APIs to be privacy safe (how they successfully do in their own APIs). But they are not. It is not about privacy. It is about revenue.
If you follow some of the conversations on GitHub when a proposal comes up from Google, which I sometimes do, there’s no simple way to make some of these APIs private. And when Apple proposes ways to do so, Google balks at them because… their revenue is based on advertising that tracks users across the web. It’s not rocket science.
Remember, Google is the only company that ships a mainstream browser that doesn’t come with privacy settings by default. There’s no features in Chrome to block trackers or limit how 3rd party cookies are used unlike Safari, Firefox and Edge.
Apple’s market cap is around 2.5 trillion dollars; while they make revenue from apps, it’s a rounding error compared to their overall market cap or their iPhone revenue.
If Apple's goal isn't to stifle App Store competition, then its goal is most likely to ensure that all web developers have to own and use Apple products. In that regard, they're basically succeeding: you can't rent macOS VMs for short periods now, emulating iOS outside the simulator on Apple hardware is very limited and mostly only done by security researchers, Safari has not been available outside of Apple hardware for a long time, and Hackintosh has been beaten down for a long time. The most reasonable option, basically OSX-KVM, still won't get you GPU acceleration, and is a clear EULA violation on non-Apple hardware.
Their strategy becomes especially self-evident when you look at WebM support. Suddenly, Apple is supporting WebM in Safari... only on macOS, where they have no choice but to compete with other browser engines. I'm so fucking sick of this shit.
It's time to stop defending Apple simply because there's a perception that they're being a prick to Google. They're being pricks to us. If we needed a savior, I can tell you for sure that savior isn't Apple. Doubt it if you want, but salvation hasn't come and it is not coming. I'm not defending Google because they definitely earned their reputation, but this attitude of blind acceptance of shit Apple does because everyone wants retribution against Google is stupid. When Apple throws a shit fit over web standards (cough WGSL cough) the party that loses isn't Google, it's us. Apple is a behemoth company that has an inordinate amount of control over the web and web standards considering how much it doesn't seem to have the best interests of the web at heart.
This rant is brought to you by every single time my code written and tested in Firefox worked totally fine in Chrome and Edge, but not Safari. It feels like this is almost every single time I do anything non-trivial anymore.
I'd like to reiterate that I am not saying Safari should implement dumb crap like WebMIDI or WebBluetooth, nor am I saying that I have any problem with their privacy or security features. All of that is fine, but it's not any more heroic than Firefox which, for all its flaws, also does a lot of the same stuff.