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TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

asia.nikkei.com

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Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#391
post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, so more like 350€/yr, including all dependents, for an employed person. That is a much better deal than (self-employed) KP, assuming the quality is good!

No, nowhere closed to that. There seems to be some confusion because Americans tend to quote things in yearly rates, while Germans tend to quote things in monthly rates. I pay just over €10k/year for my public health insurance in Germany, which is the maximum rate. (I'm self-employed, so I pay the full rate.) But that covered my whole family (wife and two kids) when my wife wasn't working. Now that she's a full-time…

Ah, ok. Thanks for the more apples-to-apples comparison. Sounds like the high-end California equivalent would be around $25k/yr, more than twice as much for a high-income self-employed head of household.

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#392

Just recently we've discussed "faltering" talks in Europe https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27161217 and "eyeing" Japan https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Tech/Semiconductors/TSMC-ey... I wonder if this media noise is more to do with negotiation tactics than with real intentions.

they are building one in japan

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

function setPostion(float x=random(), float y=random()){}

I imagine the PRNG they use for this is a rather thorough implementation. Unless perhaps it is even necessary to used a cryptographic chip to generate true randomness.

pseudocode my man, pseudocode. ignite the imagination, and let the reader run wild.

however, now my imagination is now running, and thinking about how overkill "true" random might be for this application. something "random" like an orbital sander would probably be enough. you're just trying to get away from side-to-side, left-circle, right-circle, up/down patterns. you're doing this to 3 different surfaces, so they would grind out any slight patterns which is the point. seems like a try crypto random would be as "effecient" as my roomba appears not to be.

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#394
post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the wealth inequality larger in Germany than in the US? Also, you still end up paying for all those things. And private health insurance will simply always be more expensive

According to World Bank, wealth inequality is lower in Germany compared to the US. See Gini coefficient column: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_...

You linked to the income Gini where Germany is 126th - so pretty far from being the most unequal. But if you look at the wealth Gini then Germany comes in as 20th: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_in...

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be _ecstatic_ to give up half of my salary for such a system which assures that irrespective of my employment/financial status, age or health, I'll get the care I need, until I die.

Sounds great doesn't it? Too bad in reality with public insurance you get the basic care, while with private insurace (more equivalent to the US system) you get much more. For example you can find German news articles about how public insurance doesn't cover some tests that confirm/deny if you have some life threatning condition or not, even if you have all the symptoms and the doctors says that's the next step - whi…

And Germany is one of the countries with relatively good public coverage.

I am in the UK, we don't get medicine for some things because it is too expensive: HRT has been in shortage for years, we don't get most newer cancer drugs (it is unrelated to efficacy, it is just too expensive to treat people), epilepsy drugs are the same. Because drug prices here are so low, pharmacies get drugs, and then ship them to Europe to flip. I have relatives who are sick and don't get treated because it is NHS policy not to treat conditions properly (the most well-known one is CFS, the UK's approach to CFS/ME is...unique, and governed heavily by cost). And ofc, lots of money thrown into "cheaper interventions" like public health advertising (coincidentally, the people who run these campaigns are friends with people in the NHS...which is nice for them). Mental health is another area: too expensive, massive underinvestment, even today most of the mental health system is nurses who get a couple of weeks training from psychologists, psychologists are too expensive (somehow, almost no-one who studies psychology in the UK ends up doing clinical work).

There is no trade-off. Someone has to pay because doctors don't work for free. The US has a relatively optimal system with targeted universal healthcare that is heavily subsidised by the wealthy. Germany is a derivative of that system with a relatively large private component that subsidises the rest of the system. It is far better to overproduce healthcare for the wealthy, then underproduce it for everyone else. Ofc, "free healthcare" sounds very nice (unless doctors start working for free, the cost of a US public health system would largely be what it is already...Medicare and Medicaid is cheaper...but not by much because doctor and nurses, for one, are relatively well paid...in the UK, nurses make the equivalent of $25k, again no trade-offs).

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be _ecstatic_ to give up half of my salary for such a system which assures that irrespective of my employment/financial status, age or health, I'll get the care I need, until I die.

Sounds great doesn't it? Too bad in reality with public insurance you get the basic care, while with private insurace (more equivalent to the US system) you get much more. For example you can find German news articles about how public insurance doesn't cover some tests that confirm/deny if you have some life threatning condition or not, even if you have all the symptoms and the doctors says that's the next step - whi…

Spaniard here. Define "basic". Because here you can get even cancer threatament for free.

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#397

If you consider GlobalFoundries to be a valid competitor, then that move would make a lot of sense. Infineon and AMD used to do a lot of research and production in Dresden. The AMD fab has since become a part of GlobalFoundries. But there's still a healthy ecosystem of university research and medium-sized software companies. Or at least there was, when I visited GlobalFoundries in 2014. Also, there has been a growing…

Any historic reason for the cluster to be in Dresden? I would have expected the most sophisticated areas to be in Western Germany area. Maybe govt encouraged development there?

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>TSMC Biontech vaccine deal influenced decision that'll be really stupid to build billion dollar fab just because of that. Japan can sell/donate AZ vaccine since they have a deal with AZ and American can sell moderna which Taiwan bought. either way, it is a really stupid business decision if that's case.

In context of broader geopolitical developments, it was also "really stupid" for TSMC to build new US fabs after already planning record capex in TW proper in 2019. Few thought TW would erode their silicon shield by allow TSMC to expand fabs abroad. Right now both US/EU wants to reshore semi supply chain, and both have the leverage to coerce TSMC/TW into submitting against their own interests since TSMC is wholey rel…

>it was also "really stupid" for TSMC to build new US fabs after already planning record capex in TW proper in 2019. Few thought TW would erode their silicon shield by allow TSMC to expand fabs abroad.

US is offering incentives for TSMC to build a fab in AZ. the original announcement is a smaller scale production for 5nm that won't come online for couple years. TSMC will be on 2nm by then.

Is EU offering anything? I haven't hear anything. I doubt TSMC will make the move if there is nothing for them consider the cost of a modern fab and labors cost.

>TW would erode their silicon shield by allow TSMC to expand fabs abroad

that's not smart if Taiwan is depend on silicon shield for their security. silicon shield is a media's term that Taiwanese govrt never use. a govrt shouldn't depend on anyone but itself for its own security.

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#399
post #301
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"A decent mostly free health system" Where in Germany is that? You either pay a lot for private insurance (especially when you get old) or you pay a lot for state-backed insurance (which is a lot if you earn above average as most techies do).

Since insurance is capped at around 5k salary you will at most pay 15% of that (750 EUR) for health insurance per month in the universal insurance system. If you make higher salaries then you won't be affected.

Yes. Which ... I am sorry is not "free". We can argue about it being cheap or not cheap or whatever. Sure.

But I don't get why I got downvoted for pointing out that it's not free, when that's 100% true.

750EUR public (which doesn't cover everything) or depending on age anywhere from 400 to 1500EUR private isn't "free healthcare". That's on top of high taxes etc.

Germany has a lot of great things. Free healthcare ain't one of them. Let's stay honest.

Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TSMC's innovation on production is impressive as well like the on chip water cooling. https://www.extremetech.com/computing/324625-tsmc-mulls-on-c...

3nm and the future 2nm and 1nm is all with research from Europe.

just pointing out TSMC's innovation is on the process/manufacturing side.

off the shelf equipment get you nowhere if you can't make it. Intel is the perfect example, it struggle with 10nm for so long and delay on 7nm.

if all you needs is equipment. China already dominated the foundry business with its big fund back in 2014 before trade war.

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