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Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

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Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#451

Post by LAC-Tech »

SlapperKoala wrote: post #231
LAC-Tech wrote: post #116

> The vast majority of Chinese people in the world today writing their names using the English alphabet use a system called Pinyin Pet peeve of man, but roman script is not the 'English alphabet'. Unless you think people write Spanish in 'English'... If you want to be super pedantic and say you can write pinyin using the subset of the roman alphabet that English uses, I can in turn be even more pedantic and say Pinyi…

Pinyin uses English style punctuation, which is different from what is used in other Latin alphabet languages

It also contains the letter ü. Do people also write German in English? :)

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#452

Post by shahar2k »

AYBABTME wrote: post #161

Some people take this idea to heart a bit too much. Barely anyone can pronounce my name properly and I really don't bat an eye at it. It's not pragmatic to expect most people to do so, especially in a place like the US where so many people come from different backgrounds. And that's nothing to say about the fact that the same name, written the same way, can be pronounced very differently depending on the bearer's bac…

yup! two of the three phonemes in my name just plain old dont exist in English so depending on how amused I'm feeling I either say the English version, english + explanation, or if I'm bored I simply say it in hebrew and walk away and see how the name changes the next time it's spoken back to me....

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#453

Post by shahar2k »

eyko wrote: post #283
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. Take Bob; in English, especially American English it's pronounced like "Baawhb" (exaggerated, weirdly phonetic), but over here (Dutch) it would be pronounced as "Bop", with a very short / clipped O sound. Of course there's also names that have transformed to nearly unrecognizable forms; George over here has evolved into Sjors (or the other way around?), John into Sjon, etc.

Another interesting one: James and Jacob are the same name (from the Hebrew Yaʿqob), and in spanish it's either found as "Jaime", "Jacobo" or "Santiago" which comes from "Saint Iago" (Iago being an old spanish conversion of the Latin "Iacobus" which came to other romance languages as Yago, Iaco, Jacob, Yacobo, Jacobo etc). The "J" consonant leads to many interesting things because of how many pronounciations it has.…

btw if you ever run into someone who uses the hebrew version of Jacob.... I'd go with Ya'Qov , the hard B sound at the end and the softer V sound are the same letter in hebrew but I've basically never encountered anyone who uses the hard sound

should also add Ya'Qov and Ya'a'Quov, are fairly interchangeable

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#454

Post by diehunde »

AYBABTME wrote: post #161

Some people take this idea to heart a bit too much. Barely anyone can pronounce my name properly and I really don't bat an eye at it. It's not pragmatic to expect most people to do so, especially in a place like the US where so many people come from different backgrounds. And that's nothing to say about the fact that the same name, written the same way, can be pronounced very differently depending on the bearer's bac…

Nobody should stress out too much about not getting a name right. But it's also not ok to not care at all and just go around butchering names without ever asking the proper way or even worse, ask for a nickname because they can't pronounce it (I've seen it coming from a CTO in an all-hands meeting). Both extremes are not ok.

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#455

Post by frosted-flakes »

b3morales wrote: post #414
soperj wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This reminds me of the story of the town of Versailles, Indiana. Detroit would be the same way if it wasn't such a big city. Easier to see when you add back the accent, Détroit.

Versailles, France, is much more well-known than Le Détroit, France, though. (In the U.S.)

I don't know if it's the city that's well-known so much as the Treaty of Versailles.

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#456

Post by teunispeters »

My first name is Dutch. It includes a vowel combination with no equivalent in English, although both long A as in Tanis or U as in "Tunis" (or Tuesday, which is far closer in origin) are close enough. And not (also valid) "Ee". I suppose the closest might be the French "eau" for my "Teunis". (the way I'm used to saying it almost has an almost silent "r" in it too ...)

I usually don't bother. People mess it up regardless, so for unknowns I'll use the "English" name of Tony. I hate it, but it's pronounceable by lots of speakers, including origins of several languages which also have trouble with other parts of my name. "Tony" works phonetically very well for a lot of people.

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#457

Post by maxerickson »

teunispeters wrote: post #456

My first name is Dutch. It includes a vowel combination with no equivalent in English, although both long A as in Tanis or U as in "Tunis" (or Tuesday, which is far closer in origin) are close enough. And not (also valid) "Ee". I suppose the closest might be the French "eau" for my "Teunis". (the way I'm used to saying it almost has an almost silent "r" in it too ...) I usually don't bother. People mess it up regardl…

Other than the 'r' sound, it seems to overlap with Eunice.

(based on https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDCDCFVuIls )

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#458

Post by sriku »

AYBABTME wrote: post #161

Some people take this idea to heart a bit too much. Barely anyone can pronounce my name properly and I really don't bat an eye at it. It's not pragmatic to expect most people to do so, especially in a place like the US where so many people come from different backgrounds. And that's nothing to say about the fact that the same name, written the same way, can be pronounced very differently depending on the bearer's bac…

As long as there is symmetry in expectations, I don't mind taking this stance. If some English people get miffed when non-English speakers mispronounce their names, it becomes a matter of social justice :)

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#459

Post by magnetowasright »

Wikipedia/wiktionary is an amazing resource for pronunciations if you can read IPA (or refer to their guides). It’s not a perfect solution but it’ll get you closer than just guessing until you get an opportunity to actually talk to the person. I’ve had great success with it for Irish names.

Re: Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers

#460

Post by gerbilly »

AYBABTME wrote: post #355
ZeroGravitas wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying these people should be more aware and considerate of your culture and experience as an immigrant with a hard to pronounce name in an English speaking country? That they should consider your feelings and change how they behave to suit you better? Because that sounds pretty 'woke' to me, and you seem to be attacking people for trying to be woke and annoying you in the process. I just worry that if someon…

You got me well confused here. Take my experience of the phenomenon as you wish and incorporate it or not into your decision making process, at your leisure. I'm not the only one who feels this way when citizens corner us immigrants into pronouncing our names for a while.

I think some of us feel that you sounded a bit peevish about the whole thing.
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