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PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

pine64.org

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Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#251

Post by fsflover »

deltaonefour wrote: post #232
fsflover wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It depends on the hardware you're using. Buy hardware designed for Linux and you will have no problems. Ideally, with preinstalled Linux.

Hardware designed for linux. What does that even mean? Does intel make CPUs designed for linux? No. You don't know what you're talking about. All hardware on my system have drivers available from the manufacture SO ALL of the hardware is "designed" for linux. It's just like the OP said there is poor support. So there's bugs in the software because all bug fixing resources are aimed at fixing Windows issues. So basica…

> It's just like the OP said there is poor support.

It's impossible to have good support for every available software. My Purism laptop works without issues for years. No crashes, no problems with WiFi or suspend. Just buy preinstalled Linux, like I did.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#252

Post by f6v »

boudin wrote: post #86
f6v wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An OS isn’t just an OS, it’s OS + apps. Doesn’t matter who’s fault it is. The bottom line is that productivity is affected.

It does matter. But companies should not pick software solution with garbage Linux support if some employees are using Linux. Nobody would pick a software that does not work on Windows and Macos.

There’re companies that solve it easily by just giving everyone the same laptop. Most of the times you can’t make everyone happy.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#253

Post by deltaonefour »

fsflover wrote: post #251
deltaonefour wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hardware designed for linux. What does that even mean? Does intel make CPUs designed for linux? No. You don't know what you're talking about. All hardware on my system have drivers available from the manufacture SO ALL of the hardware is "designed" for linux. It's just like the OP said there is poor support. So there's bugs in the software because all bug fixing resources are aimed at fixing Windows issues. So basica…

> It's just like the OP said there is poor support. It's impossible to have good support for every available software. My Purism laptop works without issues for years. No crashes, no problems with WiFi or suspend. Just buy preinstalled Linux, like I did.

> Just buy preinstalled Linux, like I did.

That's why linux is inferior. For windows I don't need to buy preinstalled. I can buy whatever I want.

>It's impossible to have good support for every available software.

Except windows pretty much does this. Yeah there's shady business tactics involved but at the end of the day users just want something that works. Linux fails at doing this. So I don't know why you're advising me to buy preinstalled. I can do that, but it just means Linux is FORCING me to do that because it is an inferior OS from a usability standpoint.

Buying preinstalled solves my problem but it only invalidates your point while validating my point.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#254

Post by [deleted] »

rglullis wrote: post #250
deltaonefour wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good we are all in agreement then... Windows and linux are both at the very least in the "just works" territory. But we also all agree linux is inferior because you caveat-ed your point with: "provided these peripherals are not using or dependent on extremely new protocols or standards." Windows does not generally have this issue. Linux is, by your own logic, Inferior from a usability or "just works" standpoint. We a…

[flagged]

[deleted]

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#255

Post by matkoniecz »

deltaonefour wrote: post #20
matkoniecz wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm coming to the realisation that open source projects will always provide a lower quality than comerical ones. That is not true. As far as I am concerned Linux is clearly superior OS for my laptop over commercial alternatives. > How can we honestly expect a small team of developers to compete with the larger teams a commerical project can afford? In many cases they win by default. If "no leaking of personal data"…

>That is not true. As far as I am concerned Linux is clearly superior OS for my laptop over commercial alternatives. I would argue Linux is only superior from the IT software perspective. This is a very narrow perspective that is only inflated if you're in IT or on an IT related site like HN. From almost every other dimension Linux is inferior and therefore from an Overall perspective it is inferior. The most importa…

> This is a very narrow perspective that is only inflated if you're in IT or on an IT related site like HN.

And? I was responding to extremely overstated "open source projects will always provide a lower quality than comerical ones"

Even if Linux would be worse for 99% of people who are less IT-centered than me then it would be still counterexample for "always".

Open source project can be for 5 person worldwide without monetization plan. And beat commercial software for that people.

If someone wants to make claim "for average person it is typical that..." then make it, but this hyperbole was clearly false.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#256

Post by fsflover »

deltaonefour wrote: post #253
fsflover wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's just like the OP said there is poor support. It's impossible to have good support for every available software. My Purism laptop works without issues for years. No crashes, no problems with WiFi or suspend. Just buy preinstalled Linux, like I did.

> Just buy preinstalled Linux, like I did. That's why linux is inferior. For windows I don't need to buy preinstalled. I can buy whatever I want. >It's impossible to have good support for every available software. Except windows pretty much does this. Yeah there's shady business tactics involved but at the end of the day users just want something that works. Linux fails at doing this. So I don't know why you're advis…

> For windows I don't need to buy preinstalled. I can buy whatever I want.

It just means that the manufacturer received Windows certification. Similar thing exists for Linux.

> Except windows pretty much does this.

Did you just compare the Linux community with a trillion-dollar company?

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#257

Post by matkoniecz »

erk__ wrote: post #96
matkoniecz wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm coming to the realisation that open source projects will always provide a lower quality than comerical ones. That is not true. As far as I am concerned Linux is clearly superior OS for my laptop over commercial alternatives. > How can we honestly expect a small team of developers to compete with the larger teams a commerical project can afford? In many cases they win by default. If "no leaking of personal data"…

But was Linux superior prior to it becoming a commercial project. The majority of changes in the Linux kernel have for many years been done by people hired by large companies like Intel, Huawei and Red Hat/IBM. Linux is no longer created by a small team, but is now a large commercial project.

An interesting classification issue.

Original comment contrasted "commercial software" and "open source" so I interpreted it as "paid closed source software" vs "free open source".

But it is not covering all software and in some way Linux can be described as commercial.

Still there is plenty of other cases: say editing OpenStreetMap. In theory there is some ArcGis Esri plugin but for good reasons it is used by approximately noone, with everyone using open source software.

Though some was also developed by grant-supported developers. Is it making it commercial?

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#258

Post by deltaonefour »

fsflover wrote: post #256
deltaonefour wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just buy preinstalled Linux, like I did. That's why linux is inferior. For windows I don't need to buy preinstalled. I can buy whatever I want. >It's impossible to have good support for every available software. Except windows pretty much does this. Yeah there's shady business tactics involved but at the end of the day users just want something that works. Linux fails at doing this. So I don't know why you're advis…

> For windows I don't need to buy preinstalled. I can buy whatever I want. It just means that the manufacturer received Windows certification. Similar thing exists for Linux. > Except windows pretty much does this. Did you just compare the Linux community with a trillion-dollar company?

>It just means that the manufacturer received Windows certification. Similar thing exists for Linux.

I don't need certification. I can custom build a computer and pretty much not ever be worried about incompatibility with windows. Such certifications aren't really things a regular user needs to think about for windows.

>Did you just compare the Linux community with a trillion-dollar company?

I'm comparing Linux to Windows. And I'm saying Linux is inferior from a usability standpoint. So yes I am saying the Linux community built an OS ecosystem that is INFERIOR in terms of usability to an OS ecosystem built by Microsoft. That is a Fact.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#259

Post by deltaonefour »

matkoniecz wrote: post #255
deltaonefour wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>That is not true. As far as I am concerned Linux is clearly superior OS for my laptop over commercial alternatives. I would argue Linux is only superior from the IT software perspective. This is a very narrow perspective that is only inflated if you're in IT or on an IT related site like HN. From almost every other dimension Linux is inferior and therefore from an Overall perspective it is inferior. The most importa…

> This is a very narrow perspective that is only inflated if you're in IT or on an IT related site like HN. And? I was responding to extremely overstated "open source projects will always provide a lower quality than comerical ones" Even if Linux would be worse for 99% of people who are less IT-centered than me then it would be still counterexample for "always". Open source project can be for 5 person worldwide witho…

My point is my point. Linux is generally inferior to windows from a usability standpoint.

We can get rid of the word always if you want. Nobody cares for such semantics. Generalities exist and clearly that's what most people mean when they talk about this. Linux is generally much worse from a usability standpoint than windows. Your post made a claim Linux was the better OS, but not only is Linux not always better, it's not even generally better.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#260

Post by fsflover »

deltaonefour wrote: post #258
fsflover wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For windows I don't need to buy preinstalled. I can buy whatever I want. It just means that the manufacturer received Windows certification. Similar thing exists for Linux. > Except windows pretty much does this. Did you just compare the Linux community with a trillion-dollar company?

>It just means that the manufacturer received Windows certification. Similar thing exists for Linux. I don't need certification. I can custom build a computer and pretty much not ever be worried about incompatibility with windows. Such certifications aren't really things a regular user needs to think about for windows. >Did you just compare the Linux community with a trillion-dollar company? I'm comparing Linux to Wi…

> I don't need certification.

It does not matter what you need. The fact is, 99% of computers (and of course their hardware) receive Windows certification, because it's the monopoly that everyone uses. There is practically no way to change that.

> I can custom build a computer and pretty much not ever be worried about incompatibility with windows.

See above why.

I wish Linux computers were sold in retail shops. I have no idea why they aren't.

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