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A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

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Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#201

Post by watwut »

birdyrooster wrote: post #113
watwut wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is kind of complicated, because men die sooner even if they don't do dangerous tasks. And in contemporary communes, there pretty often are not all that many super dangerous tasks to do. These communes dont have soldiers going into wars nor miners spending days in dust and dark. There used to be difference in terms of men drinking and smoking much more then women, but that is equalizing too. Basically, even if me…

My source is https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/why-men-often-die-earlie... What is yours?

The article you sent literally confirms what I said. It lists multiple reasons, more dangerous jobs being only one. The rest are mix of lifestyle and genetics.

As for smoking and alcohol, those statistics are easy to find too. Both contemporary and past ones.

Also, article starts with premise that author expects to live shorter then his wife - but he has extraordinary safe job.

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#202

Post by iamadog1029 »

MeinBlutIstBlau wrote: post #163
noduerme wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Traveling Buddhist monks in Southeast Asia live solely on donations. They don't necessarily have an individual relationship with "parishioners" any more than this particular hippie does (probably less). Whether it's beneficial for anyone for too much of society's resources to be allocated to the practice is a question. If you view spiritual comfort and the pursuit of karma as a kind of social glue, then some amount o…

The only difference is, at least in my experience, many hippies don't actually do the things necessary to create change. They are individuals touting a known consensus. It's the reason why green measures generally fail in politics but stupid things like protecting the second amendment are upheld strongly. There is no centralized institution to fight for these beliefs. This is why you see the Freedom From Religion Fou…

It couldn't possibly be that the inertia of the system at large is highly resistant to progressive policy?

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#203

Post by giantg2 »

missedthecue wrote: post #194
giantg2 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"There's no coercion other than a hungry stomach." This sounds like the classic punishment of being sent to your room without dinner, right? Removing the basic necessity of food is about as coercive as it gets. Even in civilized society we feed prisoners, give food to the hungry, etc.

A better way to phrase it would be "compelled by reality".

Maybe there's an even better way to phrase it... Other types of coercion are also part of reality.

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#204

Post by [deleted] »

noduerme wrote: post #167
helsinkiandrew wrote: post #74

I’m not sure living in the city off handouts, charity, and free tax payer provided facilities exactly promotes his no money philosophy. His life relies on the things he despises, if the economic collapse he predicts comes he will be among the first to starve to death. Go into the wild and grow/hunt food or trade some skill - the post money society doesn’t need philosopher poets scavenging cigarettes from trash cans

I've heard the nobility of homelessness and joblessness expressed as an ethos countless times by people who wouldn't care for the work of living off-grid. I happen to work in a town with some of the highest taxes in the country that's also one of the most attractive places for indigent campers. The park across from where I live has become a tent city. I get the pleasure of paying for its "upkeep" while also having to…

[deleted]

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#205

Post by [deleted] »

aunty_helen wrote: post #179
noduerme wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard the nobility of homelessness and joblessness expressed as an ethos countless times by people who wouldn't care for the work of living off-grid. I happen to work in a town with some of the highest taxes in the country that's also one of the most attractive places for indigent campers. The park across from where I live has become a tent city. I get the pleasure of paying for its "upkeep" while also having to…

>At best as a society itself, it's a drum circle, getting high, talking about the universe without doing anything much, and escaping. People have different values. Long ago we forgot that if it's not shown on mtv as something to aspire towards it's not the best pursuit of our time. All the best chasing that lambo you'll never afford whilst looking over your shoulder at others smart enough not to get into that game.

[deleted]

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#206

Post by aunty_helen »

noduerme wrote: post #184
aunty_helen wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>At best as a society itself, it's a drum circle, getting high, talking about the universe without doing anything much, and escaping. People have different values. Long ago we forgot that if it's not shown on mtv as something to aspire towards it's not the best pursuit of our time. All the best chasing that lambo you'll never afford whilst looking over your shoulder at others smart enough not to get into that game.

You're talking to someone who lived on the road for 10+ years and spent plenty of time in music circles on beaches discussing the nature of the universe. All of which came to very little. I don't work and earn to chase a new car. I do it to give my life meaning and to afford a good future for myself and my family. And yeah, I have every right to look down at the people who think they're being so smart by "not getting…

>You're talking to someone who lived on the road for 10+ years

>I have every right

>I always worked. I didn't do drugs regularly. And I never begged. I wasn't a parasite, like so many

>Where are they now? Lying in ditches, muttering to themselves.

Dude, you're a narcissist. You're free to change your values over time but no one else is? Maybe the next person squatting in your town square is a former you.

Once again, people have different values. Maybe that leads them to your hypothetical ditch, maybe it gives them motivation to be like yourself. Or maybe they find happyness some other way.

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#207

Post by sokoloff »

igorkraw wrote: post #149
sokoloff wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If this was true, why are the most boring jobs not paid the best? Likely because many of those boring jobs have many more people qualified/capable to do them than there are spots to be filled. Even though we seem to need a lot of people to take goods out of totes and put them into cardboard boxes, there are a lot more people who are able to do that work than spots needed.

So what's motivating them? The post is responded to implied it's something else than punishment.

Maybe a sense of accomplishment, a feeling that they've done something with their day, some structure, a place to be that isn't their house, something to do besides watch TV all day, some interaction with their co-workers, a bit of exercise?

Do you not feel any sense of accomplishment from mundane things that you do well once they're done? It doesn't have to solely be that they prefer food with their meals.

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#208

Post by brudgers »

noduerme wrote: post #184
aunty_helen wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>At best as a society itself, it's a drum circle, getting high, talking about the universe without doing anything much, and escaping. People have different values. Long ago we forgot that if it's not shown on mtv as something to aspire towards it's not the best pursuit of our time. All the best chasing that lambo you'll never afford whilst looking over your shoulder at others smart enough not to get into that game.

You're talking to someone who lived on the road for 10+ years and spent plenty of time in music circles on beaches discussing the nature of the universe. All of which came to very little. I don't work and earn to chase a new car. I do it to give my life meaning and to afford a good future for myself and my family. And yeah, I have every right to look down at the people who think they're being so smart by "not getting…

Is that logically distinct from sitting at a desk muttering to HN?

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#209

Post by brudgers »

willhinsa wrote: post #186
aunty_helen wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>At best as a society itself, it's a drum circle, getting high, talking about the universe without doing anything much, and escaping. People have different values. Long ago we forgot that if it's not shown on mtv as something to aspire towards it's not the best pursuit of our time. All the best chasing that lambo you'll never afford whilst looking over your shoulder at others smart enough not to get into that game.

There's a huge difference between "chasing that lambo" and working to build and keep a stable environment for your family, community, and society.

The people in the park are part of the community and a societal element.

Re: A Victoria man has gone two decades without money

#210

Post by wizzwizz4 »

mgraczyk wrote: post #119
wizzwizz4 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look: a “social Darwinist”! I should get a spotter's guide. If society preys on philosopher poets, we don't get philosophy or poetry, our ethics never develops, and the fundamental principles of society don't improve, limiting how much technological progress can raise the standard of living. I personally call that a bad outcome.

I don't think it's accurate to claim that ethics follows moral philosophy, and certainly most philosophers would not endorse that viewpoint. Philosophy doesn't tell society how to improve or behave. Philosophy helps question and understand, it hasn't historically been a driver of change.

> Philosophy helps question and understand, it hasn't historically been a driver of change.

Why do you say understanding isn't a driver of change? It seems to be pretty important to me.

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