The Framework Laptop is now shipping • Hacker News Board

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#31

Post by Dracophoenix » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:55 AM UTC

nrp wrote: post #13

itwy wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How compatible is it with Linux? Was it tested with specific distros?

We've been testing with Ubuntu 21.04 and Fedora 34. We'll be releasing guides around both of these soon and other distros in the future. On Fedora 34 respins that are going live soon, everything works out of the box, including the fingerprint reader. On Ubuntu 21.04, everything works out of the box except the fingerprint reader, which requires manually upgrading libfprint.

What about Arch, Gentoo, Nix/Guix and *BSDs?

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#32

Post by nrp » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:56 AM UTC

rasz wrote: post #22

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

Great, you "somehow" missed my questions last time around. >Every module has a QR code on it that you can scan for step-by-step instructions, support information, and a link to order a replacement from the Framework Marketplace So its a dealer "repair" where you, the dealer, sell me a repair without the labour part in a form of black box to replace? What about the schematics? the Board files? Firmware? Who is the ODM…

Apologies for the miss. There were almost 1000 comments on the last big thread! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26263508

End users have the ability to order replacement parts for every part of the laptop, down to the granularity of things like individual flex cables. We've also released reference CAD under open source licenses for the Expansion Card system for people to be able to develop their own (https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/expansioncards). Our embedded controller firmware is also open source, and we'll be posting the repository shortly. Full schematics for the rest of the system are available to independent repair shops that get Framework hardware in for repair.

Our main manufacturing partner is Compal, who makes laptops for many other large US notebook makers.

Apart from off the shelf modules like the SSD, RAM, WiFi, and LCD, the Framework Laptop is entirely custom to us, and we own all of the design and tooling. We don't have an EE on the team page, but I am actually an electrical engineer by training (or at least that's what it says on my degree from Carnegie Mellon), and our systems lead Kieran is an EE by background as well.

We own the embedded controller firmware, which is based on Chromium EC, and we'll be releasing the source soon. We use a licensed BIOS that we've customized for this go-around, but we would like to move to an open BIOS in the future.

Some of the reviewers have positive comments on their hands-on experience with the webcam. While it won't be at the level of a standalone plug-in webcam, it is substantially better than what is available in other notebooks.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#33

Post by nightski » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:57 AM UTC

luke2m wrote: post #18

viraptor wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're almost all thinking it, so... are you trying to get sued by Apple, or what's the reason for 1:1 copy of the design? Edit: To be clear, I'm not just trying to dunk on the idea. That would be the reason for me not to buy one if it looks like the vendor can fold because Apple dragged them to court.

Almost every thin and light laptop on the market these days looks like a macbook replica. And iirc, macs have a 16:10 display.

It's such a tired design. I think the goals of this project is fantastic but man the macbook is getting ugly. They really need a refresh. It feels like it has been over a decade now...

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#34

Post by queuebert » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:58 AM UTC

This would be perfect for me. I have a pile of Macs with various individual hardware failures that would never have been replaced had I been able to easily swap out new parts. (Not to mention the ridiculous hardware failure rate of Macs.)

I also hate having machines with that one piece of hardware that doesn't work on *BSD, because getting it to work is such a pain. It would be much easier to swap out the offending hardware for something more compatible.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#35

Post by nrp » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:58 AM UTC

BoysenberryPi wrote: post #26

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

2 questions: 1. Have you sent review copies to any independent review channels like LTT, Gamers Nexus, etc etc? I've seen the Tested video but that was in a very controlled environment and I'm mainly waiting on independent reviews before buying one. 2. More of a business question that I'll understand if you don't want to answer, without sharing any actual numbers, has the preorder volume been more or less than you ex…

Yes! We can't pre-announce anyone's reviews, but we have sent review units out to a few of the big tech review YouTube channels.

The pre-order volume has been roughly in line with our expectations. The one big surprise for us was just how much more popular the Framework Laptop DIY Edition is than the pre-built Framework Laptop. We expected some preference from early adopters, but it's actually multiples of volume.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#36

Post by tedk-42 » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:58 AM UTC

Hi Nirav, exciting times ahead!

Key highlights I'd like to point out is that you nailed the screen specs (3:2 and brightness) as well as the 1080p camera which is something that has always annoyed me.

Do you have a timeline of how long you expect to keep the mainboard design replaceable with this frame?

I'd personally love to see an AMD chip in there over Intel but this is right up there for my next laptop purchase (when i need!) - I expect people might wish to swap out the motherboard/cpu combo.

Also, can we expect a bigger version?

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#37

Post by geophile » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:58 AM UTC

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

Why a 3:2 display? That is an extremely odd choice. I used 4:3 displays for years, and was very pleased when wider displays became available.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#38

Post by vngzs » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 2:59 AM UTC

filereaper wrote: post #28

Any idea if we/when we can get a Ryzen based models? Ryzens have higher thread-counts and Vega Graphics outperforms Iris graphics. If this can be paired with Thunderbolt, I'd be super happy to purchase this laptop. The idea of swappable ports is great! Why not make a large 17" model with desktop components and even more ports?

Ryzen tends to get better battery too. I read an article complaining about high temperatures and bad battery life, both of which tend to be significantly better on AMD hardware. Honestly, it's the only thing keeping me from ordering one today.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#39

Post by nrp » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 3:00 AM UTC

Teever wrote: post #25

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

1. What was the sort of reaction to your unorthodox modular laptop design from the OEMs who are used to making standard laptop designs? Do OEMs have a preference for making disposable products or do you think that they see opportunity in making more modular machines that users can upgrade piece-meal over years? 2. Is there anything hardware wise that would prevent someone from making an arm based motherboard for this…

From our manufacturing partners, there was definite skepticism at first, but as we worked together it became immediately clear that what we had proposed was entirely doable! For consumer electronics brands, I think their challenge will be the business model shift that comes from focusing on longevity instead of short replacement cycles. We have a counter-positioned business model to that!

Nope, it is entirely doable from a technical perspective to build an ARM SoC-based mainboard for the Framework Laptop! I haven't seen a RISC-V SoC that has the necessary interfaces for it to work well in a laptop yet, but I strongly suspect that isn't far away.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#40

Post by binarycrusader » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 3:01 AM UTC

geophile wrote: post #37

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

Why a 3:2 display? That is an extremely odd choice. I used 4:3 displays for years, and was very pleased when wider displays became available.

Why not? Microsoft Surface devices also have a 3:2 display. Personally I love 3:2 displays as vertical space makes for a far more pleasant experience programming and reading.