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Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

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Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#171

Post by sweetheart »

Zelphyr wrote: post #9

All the critics lobbing cynicism against Bezos, Branson, and Musk saying, in essence, that their money is better spent here at home reminds me of a wonderful scene from The West Wing when one character asks why we have to go to Mars: "'Cause it's next. For we came out of the cave, and we looked over the hill, and we saw fire. And we crossed the ocean, and we pioneered the West, and we took to the sky. The history of…

This is total fallacy, I'm sorry. "We do this thing because we have always done this thing" isn't actual any justification whatsoever. It's whats leftover when realizing you're having a hard time actually justifying why it needs to be done.

"It's the way things are" are perhaps in all seriousness the 5 most dangerous words in the English language.

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#172

Post by burkaman »

ironrabbit wrote: post #118
cassac wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It deserves cynicism. If he wasn’t a jerk he’d just pay his employees more and maybe pay some taxes. When everyone is fair upfront they don’t need to give us free turkeys on thanksgiving we can buy our own.

Genuine question because I'm out of the loop: it looks to me like the "Bezos doesn't pay taxes" argument is just pointing out that most of his wealth sits in unrealized gains in amazon stock. When he sells stock, he pays taxes. Is there more to it that I'm missing? Is the prevailing argument that we should be paying taxes on unrealized capital gains?

Well, does it seem like he has realized any gains? The prevailing argument is that as a society we do not have to let one individual amass this much power. It's ok to hold that view without having a deep enough understanding of tax law to know what needs to be changed.

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#173

Post by alberth »

okintheory wrote: post #132
ironrabbit wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question because I'm out of the loop: it looks to me like the "Bezos doesn't pay taxes" argument is just pointing out that most of his wealth sits in unrealized gains in amazon stock. When he sells stock, he pays taxes. Is there more to it that I'm missing? Is the prevailing argument that we should be paying taxes on unrealized capital gains?

This is my current understanding: Basically, once you're this rich, you can take hundreds of millions or billions of dollars worth of loans to cover anything you'd like to spend. Now, you can make sure that you're actually "losing" money in any given year by having (almost) no realized income. Then, at the end, you die, having never paid taxes. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/09/briefing/tax-jeff-bezos-w... https://w…

> "Yes, this is a big part of why there's now a common argument that unrealized (but very large) capital gains should be taxed."

So how will the person pay for those taxes WITHOUT selling the underlining asset.

This is a huge problem in startup land with something called AMT. Where you "on paper" are a millionaire but have no ability to sell your paper shares since the company hasn't IPO yet.

I'd hate to live in a word where you have to pay taxes on unrealized gains because it's not like you're going to get a tax break for unrealized losses.

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#174

Post by robotresearcher »

ALittleLight wrote: post #154
okintheory wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is my current understanding: Basically, once you're this rich, you can take hundreds of millions or billions of dollars worth of loans to cover anything you'd like to spend. Now, you can make sure that you're actually "losing" money in any given year by having (almost) no realized income. Then, at the end, you die, having never paid taxes. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/09/briefing/tax-jeff-bezos-w... https://w…

But you have to repay those loans eventually incurring the tax burden when you do, right?

You die without ever selling your stocks. Your heirs can pay off your loans by selling some of the stocks they inherit. Their cost basis for those stocks is their value at the time of inheritance. This way no capital gains tax is ever due on the stock gains made in your lifetime.

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#175

Post by [deleted] »

catillac wrote: post #2

There will be a lot of cynicism on this post from the HN crowd, but these are unbelievably good recipients. I have interacted with Jose Andres many times, and go to his DC restaurants when I visit, and he is truly a wonderful soul who spends all his effort helping others. I don’t know much about Van Jones beyond what I see on TV, but if he’s of the same character as Jose Andres, that is stellar and they will both do…

[deleted]

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#176

Post by chroem- »

lupire wrote: post #113
chroem- wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Someone doesn't become a Nazi post-WWII because they believe in fascism. They do it because they are motivated by the hateful beliefs of Nazis. Thank you, this is precisely my point. How can someone still support communism after the Soviet purges, the holodomor, Chinese cultural revolution, the Cambodian genocide, etc., etc.? Communism has oppressed and killed an order of magnitude more people than fascism, but in…

This thread is about Leninist socialism, which is not Stalinist or Maoist tyranny.

That's no more of a defense than claiming you're "only" a fascist instead of a nazi.

(still waiting on the reply cooldown for the other comments ITT)

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#177

Post by avarun »

rgbrgb wrote: post #149
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We literally got to the moon before any billionaires bought joy rides to lower orbit, Once upon a time you needed nation state sponsorship in order to sail across the ocean. It's absolutely insane to me that people don't see that a billionaire can do as a vanity project something that was ~50yr ago only the purview of superpowers as an obvious sign of societal progress.

I think you're articulating exactly what the other commenters find appalling: a single man with the power of a state.

You, a single human being, can send messages from your home to the other end of the planet within a second today. This is greater power than any state had even 100 years ago.

Why compare this "single man's power" to a state from 50 years ago? It's disingenuous.

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#178

Post by pb7 »

monocasa wrote: post #164
missedthecue wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And he isn't even involved in any arcane minimization schemes. ProPublica showed that he sold ~$4 billion in Amazon stock last year and paid a billion of it to the government.

And made $100B that year. Can I get a 1% effective tax rate too?

His equity appreciated and will be taxed appropriately when it is sold.

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#179

Post by crispyambulance »

missedthecue wrote: post #104
pb7 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He pays all the taxes he owes.

And he isn't even involved in any arcane minimization schemes. ProPublica showed that he sold ~$4 billion in Amazon stock last year and paid a billion of it to the government.

Yep, and he also owns literally the largest mansion in Washington DC ( https://www.townandcountrymag.com/leisure/real-estate/news/a..., https://www.geekwire.com/2020/party-jeff-bezos-d-c-mansion-a...).

It has a Ballroom, and can host parties with hundreds of people.

Why? Because he just enjoys flying across the country and entertaining political elites out of the goodness of his heart? What could possibly be fishy here?

Re: Bezos donates $100M each to CNN contributor Van Jones and chef Jose Andres

#180

Post by whymauri »

pb7 wrote: post #165
throwaway2048 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this isn't even remotely true, in Canada for instance, if you got laid off during covid, you could get $2000 a month payments unconditionally.

In the US, you would get $600/week on top of the usual unemployment (which is 60% of your regular wage) which amounts to significantly more than Canada. For a minimum wage worker, that would be over $40K/year.

I'm sorry to inform you that in many states, like Florida, the unemployment infrastructure is purposefully built to avoid paying unemployment. You're talking about something that for millions of Americans is a pie-in-the-sky hypothetical thanks to their state legislature.

By purposefully built, I literally mean that the unemployment web services infrastructure was designed to fail at scale. Not to mention dark pattern roadblocks, insane eligibility requirements, and authorized self-sabotage.

[0] https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/0...

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