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EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

bbc.com

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Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#121

Post by SnowProblem »

meowface wrote: post #120
SnowProblem wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In practice, Bitcoin's privacy model was never even tried though. BTC fees are so prohibitively expensive that no wallet or user would generate more UTXOs or transactions than they have to, making it trivial to trace, yes. But if BTC had been allowed to scale like it was originally designed, then wallets would not fear inputting and outputting potentially hundreds of UTXOs in every transaction of varying amounts so t…

Even if it were technologically superior in some ways, the fact that it's made and run by a "Q"-like LARPer/fraudster figure makes it dead on arrival.

Been hearing this since 2018. Meanwhile

- Cryptofights alone did 600k transactions yesterday https://bsvdata.com

- Hundreds of independent games, social media, wallets, exchanges, tokens, artwork, hackathons in general creativity. https://metastore.app

- Solid user and developer experiences. https://handcash.io, https://moneybutton.com, https://cryptofights.io, https://run.network

- Thousands globally who fly to attend conferences, before covid at least https://coingeekconference.com/en/past-conferences/london-fe...

- Advanced research going into scaling Bitcoin. 50K tps demonstrated publicly, more privately. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3As9-9uSXs&t=224s

- Active community, spread across Slack, Youtube, Streamanity, Twitter, Telegram, and others. Tons of different personalities and beliefs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAPRWOwam20

Clearly dead though.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#122

Post by atatatat »

elmo2you wrote: post #83
BitwiseFool wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about generating your own wallet? Are EU citizens required to report that when they do?

I believe that the moment you hold valuable assets (i.e. any value of crypto currency) in any wallet, then you should report that (even now). I have no idea how these new rules will play out, but I can image how exchanges might be forced allow only transactions with "sanctioned" wallets (i.e. traceable to person), and international exchanges not playing complying being blocked from to the EU market.

Good luck.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#123

Post by Sargos »

ac29 wrote: post #117
ushakov wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's hosted on IPFS and the source code is on GitHub https://github.com/Uniswap

So what happens if a US government entity issues Protocol Labs a cease and desist order (they are the YC-funded, Palo Alto California based creator of IPFS)? Do they just roll over and go out of business? The network might be decentralized, but the company and people behind it are not.

What do you expect them to do? Hardcode their clients to ignore that certain CID? That obviously won't work for a whole host of reasons.

That Uniswap UI is out there and literally nothing can stop it.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#124

Post by katbyte »

SnowProblem wrote: post #121
meowface wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if it were technologically superior in some ways, the fact that it's made and run by a "Q"-like LARPer/fraudster figure makes it dead on arrival.

Been hearing this since 2018. Meanwhile - Cryptofights alone did 600k transactions yesterday https://bsvdata.com - Hundreds of independent games, social media, wallets, exchanges, tokens, artwork, hackathons in general creativity. https://metastore.app - Solid user and developer experiences. https://handcash.io , https://moneybutton.com , https://cryptofights.io , https://run.network - Thousands globally who fly to a…

you didn't address `"Q"-like LARPer/fraudster figure`

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#125

Post by Sargos »

tick_tock_tick wrote: post #93
ushakov wrote: post #52

> a company transferring crypto-assets for a customer would be obliged to include their name, address, date of birth and account number, and the name of the recipient guess what, Mr. Commissionaire? Bitcoin isn't a company and you don't need to ask companies to transfer crypto assets edit: this just shows how little power they have over the network, so they will tyrannise the middlemen instead

> Bitcoin isn't a company and you don't need to ask companies to transfer crypto assets You don't need to ask a company to commit a crime you're still going to get punished..... The vast majority of EU citizen are using some kind of exchange as an onramp and offramp. Those exchanges will do KYC and happily turn over any addresses they send/receive crypto too.

This has a limited time window of being effective as exchanges are a temporary bridge between the traditional system and the crypto economy. In a decade or so you will likely be able to do most things on crypto rails and there will be few choke points left where KYC can be enforced.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#126

Post by beervirus »

arthurcolle wrote: post #55
SavantIdiot wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty easy actually: let me give you 0.01BTC, then I'll know what you spend your money on. Forever.

This is not right - pretty much all modern wallet software generates brand new key pairs each time there is a transaction, thereby creating a new address. The unspent utxo's (unspent transaction outputs) are then sent to the new address and the old address can (but shouldn't) be used.

But anyone can see the new address to which the utxo's were sent...

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#127

Post by Sargos »

ipnon wrote: post #4

Cryptocurrency financial crimes are often masked as a technical issue inherent to decentralized, trustless networks rather than the truth; they are issues inherent to centralized, trustful systems.[a] Transfers within the blockchain are already perfectly traceable. Perfect traceability is the reason for the blockchains being. It is the interface between the blockchains and traditional finance where this problem lies.…

>The history of finance is the history of financial crime. Jews starting banks because of Christian usury laws, the Medici sidestepping the monetary power of the church and kingdoms, etc.

Most societal advancements are crimes in the beginning as those in power disagree with the new ideas of the subjects. Civil rights, religious freedom, even literacy itself was deemed to be dangerous and unacceptable in their times.

Breaking laws like this and ignoring government bureaucracy is actually quite a noble act and should be encouraged as much as possible.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#128

Post by dannyw »

thomasahle wrote: post #16
shiado wrote: post #13

Cash wouldn't be allowed to be invented today.

Cash mostly isn't allowed today, if you are transferring large enough sums of money. Probably for the better.

Better for whom? Because it's the Wikileaks, Snowdens, and Extinction Rebellions that get hurt by laws like these.

In terms of money laundering for the rich, that's all through 'fine art' and real estate.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#130

Post by sabjut »

the-dude wrote: post #57
Trias11 wrote: post #10

That's why the move to decentralized everything. This total control nonsense will eventually end and these dinosaur idiots will stuck with their own destructive ideas

> This total control nonsense Also known as taxes. > these dinosaur idiots Taxman.

I think it's really funny to see all these people think that they can with crypto game the millennia old system of taxation. Of course any sovereign nation is eventually going to break down any kinds of tax fraud.

A state unable to collect taxes ceases to be a sovereign state.

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