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Restaurant workers quit at record rate

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Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#481

Post by Kluny »

gruez wrote: post #195
nomrom wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a survival stipend competes successfully against a low-paying, high-stress, and absolutely miserable job conditions then the problem isn't the stipend, is it?

>conditions then the problem isn't the stipend, is it? It's laughable to make that comparison when the "survival stipend" is money for doing nothing. I'm not sure how any private enterprise can compete with that.

Except they're not doing nothing, are they? They're raising their kids, fixing their car, cooking healthy food, going to the doctor, visiting their mom, and any number of other things that a person working minimum wage can't make time for. The survival stipend gives them not only money, but time. When you see that, you start to realize how much those crappy jobs COST people.

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#482

Post by ruined »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #356
yepthatsreality wrote: post #4

The restaurant industry has known the solution for a long time but everyone wants to pretend it would be too difficult. Stop the tipping guilt trip placed on the public, raise your prices 20%, and pay your employees a livable wage. The public will still show up to eat in your restaurant.

This has been tried many times, you are ignoring the reasons it did not work. The employees hate it because they make less money, forcing the restaurant to go back to tipping. It was effectively a pay cut for employees. It is not wage/revenue neutral because it changes customer behavior. Generally speaking, Americans are more generous when the money goes to directly to a service person than to a faceless business tha…

That's not a problem with a tipless system, that's a management decision to lower wages. If management simply paid employees what they were netting before, or better, there would be no pay cut and no departures.

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#483

Post by dcolkitt »

ericbarrett wrote: post #73

Wages/insurance/tips are an ongoing concern of food service work, but I want to set that aside and talk about the other half of the article. Customer entitlement is out of control and anybody who works with the general public will tell you it’s gotten even worse since the pandemic—and it wasn’t trending in the right direction before. Flight attendants, park rangers, government clerks, the anecdotes are everywhere, in…

Along similar lines there's been a significant increase in auto fatalities despite the fact that miles driven went significantly down. Most of this can be attributed to people driving more aggressively and recklessly. Then there's the 30% rise in violent crime.

The truth of the matter is that America has become a much angrier society since the pandemic started.

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#484

Post by claudiulodro »

dimgl wrote: post #463
ericbarrett wrote: post #73

Wages/insurance/tips are an ongoing concern of food service work, but I want to set that aside and talk about the other half of the article. Customer entitlement is out of control and anybody who works with the general public will tell you it’s gotten even worse since the pandemic—and it wasn’t trending in the right direction before. Flight attendants, park rangers, government clerks, the anecdotes are everywhere, in…

I'm not sure what's going on, but on the flip side I've noticed a general lack of care from service workers at restaurants lately. Anecdotal evidence, obviously, but my meals have often had wrong ingredients, incorrect items, missing items, low quality items... the list goes on. This really doesn't inspire confidence or give credence to the argument that they deserve more money if they can't get basic details correct…

As they say: pay peanuts, get monkeys.

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#485

Post by brankoB »

stevejb wrote: post #319
yepthatsreality wrote: post #4

The restaurant industry has known the solution for a long time but everyone wants to pretend it would be too difficult. Stop the tipping guilt trip placed on the public, raise your prices 20%, and pay your employees a livable wage. The public will still show up to eat in your restaurant.

Guilt trip? I have never felt this ever. I pay a tip proportional to the service. 10% bad, 15% average, 20-25% for very good. As an American living in Australia, I really do miss tipping. I think that on average the restaurant service here is a lot lower. At most restaurants at the medium level (e.g. $25 hamburgers) you pay in advance, and then a waiter will bring the food to you when its ready. Do you need more wate…

The fact you're tipping 10% for bad service shows the guilt trip is working

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#486

Post by Kluny »

devwastaken wrote: post #162
k33n wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Currently, tens of millions of people. Or were you looking for a list of names?

Okay, whom ? What common factor do they share? Is it a government service?

FYI, the word you want here is "who".

https://ielts.com.au/articles/grammar-101-who-vs-whom/

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#487

Post by tshaddox »

dragonwriter wrote: post #436
pixl97 wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

does it matter if it's a technical shortage or just and observed one? The only thing preventing restaurants from changing their prices is the 'penguin on an iceberg' issue. You may be correct in raising your prices, but if other restaurants are willing to lose money longer before they raise their prices your business may suffer/fail because of it before the rest of the market changes their prices/wages.

> does it matter if it's a technical shortage or just and observed one? Yes. A so-called “observed shortage” is not a shortage, its just buyers wanting a good without wanting to pay the price it costs to buy in the present market conditions. A real shortage involves either a constraint which prevents price adjustment to an equilibrium of supply/demand or demand and supply curves shaped in such a way that no equilibri…

There is a slight distinction here though. I would tend to only describe the situation as a "shortage" if there is insufficient supply to meet demand at the actual price sellers are offering. If restaurants double their prices and thus a lot of people are no longer willing to pay (and are upset), that's not what I would consider a "shortage" (although it might certainly be described as such in headlines or in conversation). In my view that's no more a shortage than the ongoing lack of supply for private jets at the price of $10,000. I'd pay $10,000 for a private jet!

But there can also be a fuzzy area here. There may be situations where most sellers have not raised their prices to respond to decreased supply (for a variety of reasons), and therefore other mechanisms (like who gets in line the earliest) determine who gets to buy. At the same time there may be a small number of sellers who do raise prices (think of the toilet paper hoarders who resell on Craigslist at huge markups). If you consider that higher reseller price to be the "market price" then that wouldn't wouldn't strictly be a shortage, but if you consider the unchanged price to be the market price then that would indeed be a shortage. (In fact, this is why for every natural disaster there are articles with headlines like "Price gouging is actually a good thing; it's the solution to shortages.")

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#488

Post by olyjohn »

bluGill wrote: post #323
namdnay wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess it depends how often you expect to eat out. If it’s once a month, I think most can afford more expensive restaurants

Once you learn to cook you won't eat at anything less than the most expensive. It is really hard to enjoy a meal when you are thinking "I could have done this better myself at less cost". Chains and fast food just don't provide the quality I demand for the most part, and even the independents are hit and miss.

Even if you can learn how to cook, it doesn't mean you enjoy, or want to spend the time doing it.

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#489

Post by gruez »

Kluny wrote: post #481
gruez wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>conditions then the problem isn't the stipend, is it? It's laughable to make that comparison when the "survival stipend" is money for doing nothing. I'm not sure how any private enterprise can compete with that.

Except they're not doing nothing, are they? They're raising their kids, fixing their car, cooking healthy food, going to the doctor, visiting their mom, and any number of other things that a person working minimum wage can't make time for. The survival stipend gives them not only money, but time. When you see that, you start to realize how much those crappy jobs COST people.

What are you arguing here? Everything you said is consistent with "money for doing nothing".

Re: Restaurant workers quit at record rate

#490

Post by tolbish »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #461
tolbish wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much money did they make with raised wages and no tips? Was the wage still not comparable to other jobs?

I have several good friends that work in this business in Seattle, where several restauranteurs tried the "no tipping" model. Anecdotally, in a popular quintessentially Seattle restaurant, a good front-of-house person may net around $40/hr after tips, some more and some less. I don't have a lot of sample data for the "no tipping" restaurants, but my general impression is that it was on the order of a 10% reduction in…

One would think a sign out front that said "Now hiring: Wait staff, starting pay @ $40/hr (or even $30/hr)" would have no trouble finding and retaining talent, even in big cities like Seattle.

I don't think I've ever seen a sign advertising anything near that for restaurants.

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