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EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

bbc.com

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Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#41

Post by tobltobs »

gambiting wrote: post #33
thomasahle wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cash mostly isn't allowed today, if you are transferring large enough sums of money. Probably for the better.

Source of such bold claim? You can absolutely pay cash for (almost) anything. Even if you're buying a house, you can pay cash if both sides agree to it, and the solicitors check everything is legit and you can prove where you got the money from - but there is completely nothing in law that would prohibit such transaction from happening.

Payments over 10K in Cash are already forbidden in most EU countries. There are some exemptions to this rule and Germany and Austria do not have such a law until now. But it is planned to make this an EU wide law. Source: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_21_... (EU-wide limit of €10,000 on large cash payments)

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#42

Post by SavantIdiot »

Trias11 wrote: post #18

>> The new rules would also prohibit providing anonymous crypto-asset wallets. Where should I send my Ledger to so i can be a good, obedient citizen and be compliant with this law?

Pretty easy actually: let me give you 0.01BTC, then I'll know what you spend your money on. Forever.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#43

Post by sergiomattei »

ushakov wrote: post #31

i'm shocked how ignorant these lawmakers are, trying to gain control over a decentralised structure nobody asked them for this and even if this change ends up in bitcoin's core, it will ultimately fail to reach consensus our wallets are none of your business, EU, get out!

I'm shocked how naive the DeFi industry was to think they could get away with little to no regulation.

Tech doesn't rule the world. Old power structures are still in place.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#44

Post by cortesoft »

BitwiseFool wrote: post #38
nly wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 10K limit is just there to reduce admin cost. A Blockchain can be datained continuously at almost no cost

Call me paranoid but I think governments of the 21st century ultimately want the ability to track every single transaction they can.

Governments of every century wanted that. They just didn’t have the means before.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#45

Post by chippiewill »

BitwiseFool wrote: post #38
nly wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 10K limit is just there to reduce admin cost. A Blockchain can be datained continuously at almost no cost

Call me paranoid but I think governments of the 21st century ultimately want the ability to track every single transaction they can.

If you're worried about that then Bitcoin isn't for you. It's not just Governments, anyone can see _every_ transaction as it's in the public ledger.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#46

Post by vkou »

arthurcolle wrote: post #24
the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're already not allowed to move undeclared cash across borders, not sure why you can't have a rule that you can't have undeclared crypto wallets. That does not ban cryptography, that just forces people to declare their wallets.

This is completely unenforceable.

It's perfectly enforceable by asking exchanges to do KYC.

Yes, you'll be able to break the law if you turn to a hawala payment system, but I can also break the law against murder by hiring a hitman. That doesn't mean laws against murder are completely uneforceable.

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#48

Post by forty »

jsbdk wrote: post #39
gambiting wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source of such bold claim? You can absolutely pay cash for (almost) anything. Even if you're buying a house, you can pay cash if both sides agree to it, and the solicitors check everything is legit and you can prove where you got the money from - but there is completely nothing in law that would prohibit such transaction from happening.

In Spain soon it will be impossible to pay more than 1k in cash. Current limit is around 3k iirc. I guess it's the same in most EU countries.

Not sure why someone downvoted that. In France it's limited to 1000€ currently.

https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F10999

Re: EU plans to make Bitcoin transfers more traceable

#49

Post by ushakov »

sergiomattei wrote: post #43
ushakov wrote: post #31

i'm shocked how ignorant these lawmakers are, trying to gain control over a decentralised structure nobody asked them for this and even if this change ends up in bitcoin's core, it will ultimately fail to reach consensus our wallets are none of your business, EU, get out!

I'm shocked how naive the DeFi industry was to think they could get away with little to no regulation. Tech doesn't rule the world. Old power structures are still in place.

DeFi was built with censorship resistance in mind

EU can come up with new laws all day every day, but considering the technical detail, these laws will be impossible to enforce

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