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My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

danlawton.substack.com

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Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#41

Post by rocqua »

raincom wrote: post #15
rolleiflex wrote: post #12

Since this is a long article, here’s a summary for fellow readers — it’s mostly about the negative side effects of meditation that the author believes is under-documented or under-reported due to the ‘hype’ of meditation as the 21st century cure-all. He talks about dissociative experiences (which is well documented in medical research), it being a pseudo-religion, and lastly, his belief that the extended use of medit…

Isn't (esp dissociative experiences) what is called "dark nights" in the Buddhist traditions?

The article mentions that he experienced this, read about the dark night and the advice to "push through it" and that that advice backfired horribly.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#42

Post by saltmeister »

plutonorm wrote: post #38
adwn wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Congrats, you failed awakening. This is needlessly dismissive and condescending. It's like saying "Congrats, you failed running a marathon" to someone who suffers an injury after 20 kilometers.

And yet it has a grain of truth. Which tickles me.

you're both clowns in fact

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#43

Post by nix23 »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #4
WalterGR wrote: post #2

Actual title: When Buddhism Goes Bad The author was practicing a specific kind of Buddhist meditation while at a 2-week meditation seminar. It sounds like he was meditating most of his waking hours? This is not about “mindfulness” as you probably think of it.

One should meditate always, also also during their sleep. let alone while doing chores, walking and talking. Formal sitting meditation is just a minor part.

Not sure about during sleep, but meditation is nothing else then to life and think in the present, give your brain a task and focus just on that, then the next one. If you go into the future or past do it intended.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#44

Post by bingu »

Zababa wrote: post #21

This is probably a relatively naive observation, but I've found that the way some people describe meditation and how their mind change is sometimes the same as how people describe their experience under psychadelics. These bad side effects of meditation sound a bit like a bad trip, but without being able to tell yourself that it's chemically induced and thus will stop in a few hours.

Yes. From experience I can attest that they are two doors to the same house, so to speak.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#45

Post by phist_mcgee »

Zababa wrote: post #21

This is probably a relatively naive observation, but I've found that the way some people describe meditation and how their mind change is sometimes the same as how people describe their experience under psychadelics. These bad side effects of meditation sound a bit like a bad trip, but without being able to tell yourself that it's chemically induced and thus will stop in a few hours.

As someone who dabbles in mushroom based psychedelics you are right. The sudden awareness of yourself, and even moreso the sudden awareness of 'not yourself' can be pretty frightening. I have had bad trips before, and they usually began with an untethering of yourself. Once you start floating outside of your life/personality, you can become very distressed with what is left. It can become almost scarring to see yourself from afar suffering so badly, but that be not yourself. It's hard to put into words, but that experience of intense disassociation, and the pain of being an observer to it is very real.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#46

Post by eurasiantiger »

> And I didn’t have a history of any major trauma prior to the retreat

Yeah, right.

> in 2009 I started a fist fight in a French Quarter bar … I broke a window with my fist, misplaced my shirt, and guzzled about 16 bottles of Miller High Life … > That … represented a constant battle I had waged over the prior decade with anger and other negative emotions. I drank too much. I occasionally smashed printers that jammed. I had volatile relationships …

Would put my money on unacknowledged childhood trauma.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#47

Post by rolleiflex »

stinos wrote: post #24
rolleiflex wrote: post #12

Since this is a long article, here’s a summary for fellow readers — it’s mostly about the negative side effects of meditation that the author believes is under-documented or under-reported due to the ‘hype’ of meditation as the 21st century cure-all. He talks about dissociative experiences (which is well documented in medical research), it being a pseudo-religion, and lastly, his belief that the extended use of medit…

in the way that it renders a person not less, but more susceptible to breakage from smaller stresses That should be can render I think, the author seems well aware that what happened about him isn't bound to happen to anyone.

Good idea, I just corrected it. Thanks.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#48

Post by mlang23 »

icybox wrote: post #36
mlang23 wrote: post #33

> This terrain was fresh. I had never previously experienced a psychotic episode and have no history of mental illness besides occasional bouts of mild anxiety and depression. ... > Why did I start meditating? The short answer is that in 2009 I started a fist fight in a French Quarter bar over some jambalaya, a steamy kiss, and a stray comment I didn’t take fondly. The evening ended hours later after I broke a window…

Alan Watts used to say "When you've received the message, hang up the phone."

Good point.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#49

Post by phist_mcgee »

JimTheMan wrote: post #5

"Why my swimming practice, which involved me swimming the english channel every day, eventually led me to drown."

An unkind sentiment. Every individual is unique, and some can stomach challenges that would make others fall to their knees. It's our different strengths and weaknesses that make us.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown

#50

Post by simiones »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #3

> The terrain of fractured, disruptive and altered states of consciousness has often been explored in Buddhist teachings through the centuries, but when these practices made their journey into Western culture, a sufficient understanding of the downsides of meditation was lost in transit. Why would one go on a serious retreat not led by a real Buddhist teacher? Is there a shortage of geshes already?

How do you tell a real Buddhist teacher from a fake one?

What if you are interested in secular meditation and do not believe Buddhism or other religions are truthful?

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