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Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

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Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#61

Post by monocasa »

JustStoppinIn89 wrote: post #29
chayleaf wrote: post #11

Guess this is the "Linux Subsystem for Windows" some people have been missing... Too bad it requires 2 GPUs

No, it's nothing like that at all. It's only that if you wear a fedora unironically and have a Slashdot account with a four digit user ID.

I see the comparison. WSL2 is running a full Linux kernel on top of a hypervisor with an eye towards reducing the overhead of running both kernels (see the recentish discussion on lkml about Microsoft trying to upstream para virtualized directx). When you combine that with the fact that Windows's interface is both more GUI forward and closed to interesting modifications, then the same user model "I want to run both kernels and their user code with as low of overhead as possible in both ux and compute power" this is what you'd come up with for Windows on Linux compared with modern WSL's Linux on Windows.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#62

Post by Jach »

Kiboneu wrote: post #45

Reminds me of the time I'd use a patched ACPI table on my gaming VM to mock a battery for the NVIDIA driver (similar to [0]). The drivers checked and deliberately failed when a battery wasn't present in conjunction with a mobile GPU. Setting up looking glass itself wasn't much of a problem though. I got some AAA games cutting on my gentoo laptop like butter, though the mouse movement was more jelly unless I VFIOd my…

These days many AAA games work well in Gentoo thanks to Proton, though I still dual boot (to Windows 7...) for a lot of games. Looking Glass is pretty cool, though perhaps it's a bit too late. My next Windows on a new computer will be either 10 Enterprise LTSC or 11 if 11 doesn't suck, but I still plan to run Gentoo as my primary. If your NixOS experience matches your expectations over the next year, it'd be neat to hear about it later -- I looked at Nix a long time ago but I've been a happy Gentoo user since 2007 and I still see no reason to move. I've gotten a bit old, but the maintenance is low, every time I use another distro it inevitably annoys me for not being like Gentoo, and anyway the upkeep sort of feels like gardening, not like a pain in the butt.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#63

Post by x3sphere »

JustStoppinIn89 wrote: post #52
throwawayswede wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you elaborate on the finickiness of it? What kind of "fixes" you needed to do, and how often really, and with a cause or just random with no precursors?

Everything about it is fickle. Motherboards and USB controllers present themselves different from maker to maker, and SKU to SKU. Any change in your hardware -- including plugging in something like a USB device -- sets off a chain of fighting the host OS and virtual machines for who gets to use that device, who gets to see that device at all, and the drivers needed for the hardware. No one is making user software wit…

Apart from some initial issues it’s mostly been set it and forget it for me? I’ve been running a VFIO setup since 2017.

GPU driver updates haven’t broken anything in years. Nvidia actually made their drivers more passthrough friendly not too long ago (No longer need to spoof the vendor ID).

I have not had any compatibility issues with software either. I know there are some multiplayer games that specifically check if you are running in a VM and refuse to run. It’s a handful of games though and I don’t play those.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#64

Post by cdata »

zaptheimpaler wrote: post #57

I run a VFIO setup with a single GPU - the linux host is headless, and Windows runs on top with the GPU. Its pretty awesome. Windows runs at native performance - no problem gaming or running other heavy workloads. The linux host acts as a devbox and runs a few other homeserver style services. It's difficult to set up right but it taught me a lot about VMs and hardware. Once you get it setup well enough, its relativel…

Which games do you play that require anti-cheat schemes?

The last time I checked, many such games explicitly do not support running in VMs and you risk being banned by obfuscating that you are running the game in a guest OS.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#65

Post by Google234 »

zaptheimpaler wrote: post #57

I run a VFIO setup with a single GPU - the linux host is headless, and Windows runs on top with the GPU. Its pretty awesome. Windows runs at native performance - no problem gaming or running other heavy workloads. The linux host acts as a devbox and runs a few other homeserver style services. It's difficult to set up right but it taught me a lot about VMs and hardware. Once you get it setup well enough, its relativel…

Better anti cheats won’t allow setups like this.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#66

Post by Google234 »

cdata wrote: post #64
zaptheimpaler wrote: post #57

I run a VFIO setup with a single GPU - the linux host is headless, and Windows runs on top with the GPU. Its pretty awesome. Windows runs at native performance - no problem gaming or running other heavy workloads. The linux host acts as a devbox and runs a few other homeserver style services. It's difficult to set up right but it taught me a lot about VMs and hardware. Once you get it setup well enough, its relativel…

Which games do you play that require anti-cheat schemes? The last time I checked, many such games explicitly do not support running in VMs and you risk being banned by obfuscating that you are running the game in a guest OS.

For EAC, they require a variety of signals to ban someone (unless it’s a obvious thing like detecting a known cheat.) An honest VM setup that doesn’t obfuscate probably counts as one potential signal that you are cheating, an obfuscated one that they are able detect might be a stronger signal.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#67

Post by gnif »

cdata wrote: post #64
zaptheimpaler wrote: post #57

I run a VFIO setup with a single GPU - the linux host is headless, and Windows runs on top with the GPU. Its pretty awesome. Windows runs at native performance - no problem gaming or running other heavy workloads. The linux host acts as a devbox and runs a few other homeserver style services. It's difficult to set up right but it taught me a lot about VMs and hardware. Once you get it setup well enough, its relativel…

Which games do you play that require anti-cheat schemes? The last time I checked, many such games explicitly do not support running in VMs and you risk being banned by obfuscating that you are running the game in a guest OS.

Most games work just fine, just a few odd ones that decided to block VMs don't such as Tarkov.

Known to work without issue are titles such as

  * PUBG
  * Battlefield 1/3/4/5
  * Titanfall 1&2
  * Arma 3
  * 7 Days to Die
  * Ark
  * Fortnite
  * Apex
  * Halo: The Master Chief Collection
  * Star Wars Squadrons
And many many more.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#68

Post by zaptheimpaler »

cdata wrote: post #64
zaptheimpaler wrote: post #57

I run a VFIO setup with a single GPU - the linux host is headless, and Windows runs on top with the GPU. Its pretty awesome. Windows runs at native performance - no problem gaming or running other heavy workloads. The linux host acts as a devbox and runs a few other homeserver style services. It's difficult to set up right but it taught me a lot about VMs and hardware. Once you get it setup well enough, its relativel…

Which games do you play that require anti-cheat schemes? The last time I checked, many such games explicitly do not support running in VMs and you risk being banned by obfuscating that you are running the game in a guest OS.

Ive played PUBG, COD Warzone, Apex Legends, Quake Champions, maybe a few others. Of course it depends on the game but i think the perception of how many games don't work under VMs is a bit skewed.

TBH every thread like this has the “but what about anti-cheat?” post which makes it seem like a big problem but i think only a tiny minority of games don’t work under VMs.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#69

Post by gnif »

Jach wrote: post #62
Kiboneu wrote: post #45

Reminds me of the time I'd use a patched ACPI table on my gaming VM to mock a battery for the NVIDIA driver (similar to [0]). The drivers checked and deliberately failed when a battery wasn't present in conjunction with a mobile GPU. Setting up looking glass itself wasn't much of a problem though. I got some AAA games cutting on my gentoo laptop like butter, though the mouse movement was more jelly unless I VFIOd my…

These days many AAA games work well in Gentoo thanks to Proton, though I still dual boot (to Windows 7...) for a lot of games. Looking Glass is pretty cool, though perhaps it's a bit too late. My next Windows on a new computer will be either 10 Enterprise LTSC or 11 if 11 doesn't suck, but I still plan to run Gentoo as my primary. If your NixOS experience matches your expectations over the next year, it'd be neat to…

Just FYI, Looking Glass has been in development for over three years now, so it's not actually as late as you think :).

Also proton doesn't address the myriad of productivity applications that people still need windows for, such as Adobe products, or Autocad, etc.

Re: Looking Glass: Run a Windows VM on Linux in a window with native performance

#70

Post by gigatexal »

gnif wrote: post #67
cdata wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which games do you play that require anti-cheat schemes? The last time I checked, many such games explicitly do not support running in VMs and you risk being banned by obfuscating that you are running the game in a guest OS.

Most games work just fine, just a few odd ones that decided to block VMs don't such as Tarkov. Known to work without issue are titles such as * PUBG * Battlefield 1/3/4/5 * Titanfall 1&2 * Arma 3 * 7 Days to Die * Ark * Fortnite * Apex * Halo: The Master Chief Collection * Star Wars Squadrons And many many more.

The only games I play are Doom Eternal and Starcraft 2 — by chance do you know if those work or if there’s a list somewhere?
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