Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content” • Hacker News Board

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#961

Post by fsckboy » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 4:57 PM UTC

weare138 wrote: post #709

contravariant wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's something fundamentally flawed about the idea that censorship in the name of preventing misinformation is protecting the foundation of democracy. You cannot have true democracy if people cannot disagree with their governments, they must be able to disagree with any truth or opinion such a government might consider self-evident, just on the off chance they're right. I should at this point note that Google does…

>You cannot have true democracy if people cannot disagree with their governments, they must be able to disagree with any truth or opinion such a government might consider self-evident, just on the off chance they're right. Google is not the government. It's a private company owned by private citizens who also have the same constitutional rights. You're not being 'censored'. It's not a violation of your free speech. Y…

> It's not a violation of your free speech.

captain pedantic, you meant to say it's not a violation of the first amendment.

censorship is a violation of free speech

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#962

Post by malandrew » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:00 PM UTC

admax88q wrote: post #950

exporectomy wrote: post #876

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Though that's what happens, I don't think people call that misinformation but rather bias. Isn't misinformation factually wrong in the common meaning?

I think it's less about being factually wrong, and more about leading people to factually wrong conclusions with truthful statements. Even just saying "X sells stock Y before event Z" imples that X knew about event Z and that it would affect the stock price of Y. People will read headlines like this and walk away assuming there was insider trading, but that may not be the case. Nothing in that example headline has to…

A lot of this type of misleading rhetoric often boils down to simply exploiting that many humans mistake correlation for causation and our education system really hasn’t don’t enough to hammer in not confusing those two.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#963

Post by javajosh » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

People often forget that "slippery slope" is a fallacy. Political censorship is indeed of general concern; censoring anti-vax bullshit does not imply an inevitable path to political censorship.

The real solution, of course, is to out the hypocrisy and malfeasance of the spineless GOP/Fox leadership that panders to this ignorance, and gives it mainstream legitimacy. Without that legitimacy, these conspiracy theories will fade back into background noise where they belong.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#964

Post by unethical_ban » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

ibbibby wrote: post #748

"Misinformation" is just another word for "falsehood" or "untruth." Those of you claiming that "democracy" depends on authorities preventing the spread of misinformation are ipso facto saying that democracy requires the government, or megacorporate cartels with a monopoly on public speech most likely acting as proxies for the government (as Psaki made clear is happening), to define what counts as "truth" (a Ministry…

I think we should be wary of enforcing a particular truth or narrative. I think society should be vigilant against government punishing people for what they think or say - that is anathema to the freedom guaranteed to us in the 1st Amendment.

However, your analysis doesn't acknowledge the very real war on truth being fought daily on a multitude of fronts. There are many actors, and many reasons they are doing it.

Some people just want to watch the world burn (troll armies, 4chan-like people, alt-right, etc). Some people want to keep ignorant people in their place, and pit people against each other (cable 'news", especially Fox).

People are being exposed to misinformation (deliberate lies about the state of current affairs) more and more easily than ever before.

It's like saying we have a freedom to hold whatever rocks we find on the ground, then someone finding a block of uranium. Sure, we have that freedom, but there is a very real danger and we need to figure how to deal with the more dangerous aspects of it. Censorship/government enforcement is a heavy hammer and I don't think it's the answer - but that doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#965

Post by unethical_ban » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:20 PM UTC

bigbluedots wrote: post #791

intended wrote: post #751

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We aren’t talking about something as basic as truth and untruth. This is Integer and float vs malformed code. Misinformation is code. It’s designed to specifically take advantage of gaps in our society and spread in such a way that makes it harder to challenge it.

In a free society, people must be allowed the ability to discern for themselves which information is useful, true, or otherwise. We do not need a state or its proxies to tell us which information is correct.

That's a nice fantasy. People don't get enlightened by banging rocks to start fires for 18 years then becoming a philosopher.

The art of thinking critically and using logic takes training, and far too many people don't seem to have those skills, due to an inadequate education system in the United States.

Free people should be "allowed" to listen to, and say, what they want. I don't even think Tucker Carlson should be silenced by the government, no matter how much better I think society would be without him on the air.

I think there is a space for content to be labelled as "bullshit" by the people hosting it. Youtube labeling anti-vax lies as "misinformation", the FCC disallowing Fox from using the term "News" on its marquee during their "Four Hours of Hate" from 5-9pm.

Just as fast food is allowed to be sold to people, but they're required to disclose nutrition data - people should be allowed to listen to and spout bullshit, but it should be labeled.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#966

Post by chaganated » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC

semitones wrote: post #164

chaganated wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

resignation or gtfo

maybe soon

good on ya

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#967

Post by _-david-_ » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:35 PM UTC

knownjorbist wrote: post #782

_-david-_ wrote: post #533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This virus is the prime example of why most people here are against thingd like this. Look how many times the government officials have flipped on all of this virus stuff. One day it is completely debunked, discredited and misinformation to suggest the virus came from a lab. The next day it is a plausible theory. We cannot trust banning misinformation because we don't know what is actually misinformation. What is mis…

Your perception of the lab leak "flip flop" is exaggerating what actually happened. This is a really dangerous road to go down. Yesterday's misinformation is still largely if not entirely misinformation. The same will hold true into the future. A lot of the world's woes can be traced back to people operating on bad information.

First, I didn't say flip flop. I said flipped. Once the authorities changed their mind on something they didn't go back to the previous opinion. If you are going to put quotes around text at least make it something I actually said.

Next, the lab leak is just an example. You can look at other things like masks, whether or not it is airborne, and other things like that. I understand they didn't have all the available information but they sure sounded 100% positive they knew what they were talking about.

Imagine if we could not ever change our societal views on anything? Once something is determined anything else is considered misinformation. I am sure you hold a view that is not the view held by the majority. How would you like any facts you state about that thing banned and labeled misinformation? That is what will happen if this continues.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#968

Post by sofixa » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 5:54 PM UTC

bigbluedots wrote: post #791

intended wrote: post #751

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We aren’t talking about something as basic as truth and untruth. This is Integer and float vs malformed code. Misinformation is code. It’s designed to specifically take advantage of gaps in our society and spread in such a way that makes it harder to challenge it.

In a free society, people must be allowed the ability to discern for themselves which information is useful, true, or otherwise. We do not need a state or its proxies to tell us which information is correct.

That's so naïve.. If only sufficient amounts of people were capable of discerning for themselves which information is useful, true, etc.

The rise of batshit crazy and easily demonstrably false conspiracy theories like Qanon, flat earthers, 5G, Covid is fake/a Chinese bioweapon/etc. Pizzagate, what have you, and clearly empty populist politicians and political movements across the world show that way too much people struggle with that. And the choices they make impact all of us.

I honestly don't think there's a solution for this. Any authority on "truth" will be abused, but what we have now doesn't work either.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#969

Post by rscoots » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 6:00 PM UTC

avivo wrote: post #173

Google can do a much better job of making clear what is out of scope. When I first saw this headline I was also surprised and outraged. Looking more closely, this is just about distribution , probably in terms of "content hosting". It doesn't target individuals or families storing whatever they want for themselves. This made more sense in that context. For example, if I create a fake video urging people to vote illeg…

>For example, if I create a fake video urging people to vote illegally, or at the wrong time

Just so you know, this is a federal crime so Google is legally required to remove such content. So that specific example doesn't really apply.

Re: Google Drive bans distribution of “misleading content”

#970

Post by rscoots » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 6:18 PM UTC

sillysaurusx wrote: post #501

Throwing in my comment like a penny down a wishing well: Google recently turned off my gmail because my google drive quota was exceeded . They were "protecting" me from myself, by denying me the ability to buy more storage. They refuse to accept any payment method until I deliver a passport photo to them. The problems here go a bit beyond them being the steward of information or arbiter of right vs wrong. They'll den…

>That said, they can ban distribution of misleading content. It's their right, and no one can dispute that. I'm not sure what people hope to accomplish by expressing outrage over this.

Since when is encouraging mega-corporations to act morally a bad thing? Or some sort of waste-of-breath, as you imply here.