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Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

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Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#81

Post by virtue3 »

andy_ppp wrote: post #78
hellbannedguy wrote: post #12

Out of all the celebrities, Bourdain would have viscerally despised this. He hated fake phoney people, or food. He hated when his production crew would stovepipe his bits. He hated a scene in Greese (I believe) where crew went out and bought squid, and threw them into the water to made the shoot better. I really liked Bourdain. He was one of the few celebrities that didn't seem to change with fame, or money. I watche…

As I understand it (I read this on Twitter so massive grain of salt etc.) the family concented to this explicitly. Would you feel better if it was a voice actor who could read Bourdain’s email in a perfect mimic? What about historical recreations, would you object to computers being involved in, say, recreating Abraham Lincoln’s voice? Does the age of the subject matter? I think the squeamishness about AI as it becom…

Historical recreations are fine.

Creating a digital voice model of abraham lincoln and then using it for ??? is not.

All of this is being done for profit means (the orville redenbacher, fast furious, star wars).

Just because we can doesn't mean we shouldn't stop and think if we should.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#82

Post by andy_ppp »

briefcomment wrote: post #80
andy_ppp wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it (I read this on Twitter so massive grain of salt etc.) the family concented to this explicitly. Would you feel better if it was a voice actor who could read Bourdain’s email in a perfect mimic? What about historical recreations, would you object to computers being involved in, say, recreating Abraham Lincoln’s voice? Does the age of the subject matter? I think the squeamishness about AI as it becom…

His widow did not provide consent [1]. [1] https://twitter.com/OttaviaBourdain/status/14158894550057164...

Cool, great to get that clarified but also good to see I didn’t invent the fact they claimed to have asked.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#83

Post by xwdv »

Personally I think this is interesting, ethics be damned. It is obvious the direction we are going with these kind of technologies. We will be able to create entirely new content using the personalities of deceased people out of whole cloth.

Some day we may be reduced to nothing more than a pile of ashes and a USB stick with our personality reincarnated into it. That's far better than simply being a pile of ashes, and may be the closest we get to some kind of immortality, a way to keep our ego wandering the digital world long after we've died and gone to wherever you choose to believe.

Combined with advanced AR technology, all it may take is putting on some glasses to see the ghosts of your ancestors wandering the real world and interacting with it. Well, maybe not our ancestors. We will be the ancestors, and our descendants will be the ones watching us, tending to our digital souls.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#84

Post by httpz »

BrandoElFollito wrote: post #63
httpz wrote: post #40

There are ethical concerns but I think we'll just learn to live with it. Forging signatures are easy and have been around forever but signatures are still used for very important purposes (even electronically now!). It may take a while for the legal system to catch up and using voice recordings as evidence may be tricker than before. But on a more exciting front, I think synthetic voice can be made like fonts. Celebr…

Signatures used for very important purposes are only decoration. They must be used in conjunction with something else (a notary, an independent exchange that confirms that the signature is actually binding, etc.). The electronic signature is completely different: there is no visible artefact anymore, but a process that seals a document and (under appropriate legislation), certifies that the signer is who he is. A vis…

What you listed are just ways we've learned to live with the forgeable nature of signatures. Now voice recordings (and even videos) will have a similar fate in the future.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#85

Post by [deleted] »

hellbannedguy wrote: post #12

Out of all the celebrities, Bourdain would have viscerally despised this. He hated fake phoney people, or food. He hated when his production crew would stovepipe his bits. He hated a scene in Greese (I believe) where crew went out and bought squid, and threw them into the water to made the shoot better. I really liked Bourdain. He was one of the few celebrities that didn't seem to change with fame, or money. I watche…

[deleted]

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#86

Post by andy_ppp »

virtue3 wrote: post #81
andy_ppp wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it (I read this on Twitter so massive grain of salt etc.) the family concented to this explicitly. Would you feel better if it was a voice actor who could read Bourdain’s email in a perfect mimic? What about historical recreations, would you object to computers being involved in, say, recreating Abraham Lincoln’s voice? Does the age of the subject matter? I think the squeamishness about AI as it becom…

Historical recreations are fine. Creating a digital voice model of abraham lincoln and then using it for ??? is not. All of this is being done for profit means (the orville redenbacher, fast furious, star wars). Just because we can doesn't mean we shouldn't stop and think if we should.

On which timescale does something become historical? Are the Beatles historical, to you maybe not but possibly to your children? Where is the line you’re drawing?

If I’m honest humans have never done the moral thinking, we largely just middle through and hope to get away with it.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#87

Post by 37r7dyysy »

godelski wrote: post #72
jamestimmins wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, this whole issue could be solved with a message before the film runs about how the voiceover is created, and then a "recreation" label during that scene.

I don't think so. There are still other ethical considerations. Bourdain likely would not have liked this, as others in the thread point out. So it is weird to honor someone with a documentary but not honor their wishes

What makes those considerations significant enough to be worth the effort of evaluating though? It's too late to stop the tech from existing, there's no individuals actually being harmed, and even if you find a framework for arguing harm that's compelling the end-game is just going to be updated contracts which demand rights to use the performer's likeness for these sorts of purposes. The dialogue just seems like a lot of opining for the sake of itself with a fashionable hint of 21st century doom-cult luddism. I guess maybe the unions might have a reason to worry but I don't have a lot of sympathy for unions representing millionaires.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#88

Post by patrickthebold »

andy_ppp wrote: post #86
virtue3 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historical recreations are fine. Creating a digital voice model of abraham lincoln and then using it for ??? is not. All of this is being done for profit means (the orville redenbacher, fast furious, star wars). Just because we can doesn't mean we shouldn't stop and think if we should.

On which timescale does something become historical? Are the Beatles historical, to you maybe not but possibly to your children? Where is the line you’re drawing? If I’m honest humans have never done the moral thinking, we largely just middle through and hope to get away with it.

Time doesn't matter as much as what is said. Fake Anthony Bourdain voice reading something he wrote seems fine to me, especially in the context of, say, a documentary.

John Lennon's voice doing an ad for Vox amps seems in poor taste.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#89

Post by inlikealamb »

autoexec wrote: post #75
inlikealamb wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but nobody really expects the food they get will look anything like the food in the ad did Have you ever worked at a restaurant? It's not as unusual as you think. A lot of us on HN are in bubbles of savvy people because of our tech-related professions, and most people are NOT savvy. Many people never consciously think about the images they're subjected to.

Wouldn't it be a problem for the restaurant if people were contently sending food back or being disappointed by the product because it didn't look like the ad? I mean, the difference is striking! (see https://i.imgur.com/e9EaVbu.jpeg ). If I genuinely expected the first burger in that image and got served the second one I'd demand my money back and maybe never step foot in that restaurant again! Wouldn't most people?…

I worked restaurants through college and I've probably had food thrown at me over a dozen times because it didn't look like the menu!

It's not the norm, but it's not completely unusual. I've had many more people complain about the disparity in less severe terms. It's a very weird world out there, and if I've learned anything it's that I'm incredibly lucky to have any amount of self-awareness because a lot of people are running around out there on pure id... unaware of just about anything. If you're at all skeptical about anything you're ahead of the curve.

Re: Voice clone of Anthony Bourdain prompts synthetic media ethics questions

#90

Post by tayo42 »

andy_ppp wrote: post #86
virtue3 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historical recreations are fine. Creating a digital voice model of abraham lincoln and then using it for ??? is not. All of this is being done for profit means (the orville redenbacher, fast furious, star wars). Just because we can doesn't mean we shouldn't stop and think if we should.

On which timescale does something become historical? Are the Beatles historical, to you maybe not but possibly to your children? Where is the line you’re drawing? If I’m honest humans have never done the moral thinking, we largely just middle through and hope to get away with it.

Idk if historical is based on time. I think intention is more important. if you recreate the Beatles purely for profit then it seems unethical and disrespectful. if you want to keep someone's voice for record keeping or something educational that seems different
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