Pharo 9 • Hacker News Board

Re: Pharo 9

#71

Post by Zababa » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 12:54 PM UTC

xkriva11 wrote: post #29

This is a long list of rare features that make Pharo interesting: https://pharo.org/features

I don't know if it's my eyesight declining but that postcard is hard to read. Wikipedia has a svg file with higher resolutions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Pharo_syntax_postcard.svg

Re: Pharo 9

#72

Post by mark_l_watson » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 12:56 PM UTC

adius wrote: post #3

And 10 years later still no proper support for retina displays. I really think you should get your priorities straight.

Pharo handles the Retina display on my new MacBook Pro just fine.

Re: Pharo 9

#73

Post by a2800276 » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:00 PM UTC

The page seems to be going out of it's way to not mention the word "Smalltalk". Does anyone have an idea why that is? Does Smalltalk have such a bad reputation nowadays or has someone trademarked the term?

Re: Pharo 9

#74

Post by estebanlor » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:00 PM UTC

Zenchess wrote: post #4

Just a heads up the pharolauncher does not seem to be working for me, at least for pharo 9. Manual download of vm + image 64bit works but 32 bit does not. I have been making pharo raylib bindings and plan to make a video soon about why Smalltalk is an interesting choice for game development, it's a very 'live-coding' feel, i.e. you run your game while the editor is still live, you have free reign to at any time modif…

there was a problem with the PhL, that took more time to update of what we thought. Now it should be working... but please take into account that 32bit versions are deprecated (unless you're working on ARM)

Re: Pharo 9

#75

Post by Communitivity » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:07 PM UTC

This looks like an amazing environment and interesting language. The first thing I thought of was a version of Croquet [1] using Pharo. Another thing it reminds me a bit of is HyperCard.

[1] https://planetcroquet.squeak.org/

Re: Pharo 9

#76

Post by Tepix » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:14 PM UTC

frou_dh wrote: post #12

krageon wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Retina displays don't matter because the majority of your users don't have them. Problem solved :)

Surely most decent laptops being sold are HiDPI at this point?

There isn't a proper definition for HiDPI. Displays used to be around 100ppi. Nowdays, the majority of notebooks - even cheap ones - feature a FullHD display. For example when i list all notebooks on gh.de and limit the maximum price to 600€ of the 599 listed laptops 389 of them have a pixel density of 150ppi or higher.

For a price up to 500€ it lists 306 laptops with 176 having 150+ppi.

Re: Pharo 9

#77

Post by zabzonk » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:15 PM UTC

a2800276 wrote: post #73

The page seems to be going out of it's way to not mention the word "Smalltalk". Does anyone have an idea why that is? Does Smalltalk have such a bad reputation nowadays or has someone trademarked the term?

I've noticed that as well - it's a bit strange given that Pharo is a fork of Squeak, which does proclaim its ST origins on its front page.

I wouldn't say Smalltalk has a bad rep nowadays, but it used to be knocked for being too expensive (the cost of ST licences back when was beyond a joke), too slow, and producing nasty-looking non-native GUIs. These have almost all been fixed.

Re: Pharo 9

#78

Post by zabzonk » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:18 PM UTC

estebanlor wrote: post #74

Zenchess wrote: post #4

Just a heads up the pharolauncher does not seem to be working for me, at least for pharo 9. Manual download of vm + image 64bit works but 32 bit does not. I have been making pharo raylib bindings and plan to make a video soon about why Smalltalk is an interesting choice for game development, it's a very 'live-coding' feel, i.e. you run your game while the editor is still live, you have free reign to at any time modif…

there was a problem with the PhL, that took more time to update of what we thought. Now it should be working... but please take into account that 32bit versions are deprecated (unless you're working on ARM)

It (Pharo9 launcher I just downloaded) seems to want to launch my Pharo7 installation. Should I uninstall everything and try again?

Re: Pharo 9

#79

Post by xkriva11 » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:19 PM UTC

a2800276 wrote: post #73

The page seems to be going out of it's way to not mention the word "Smalltalk". Does anyone have an idea why that is? Does Smalltalk have such a bad reputation nowadays or has someone trademarked the term?

It follows Kay's advice:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EMJoLicXsAA7dej?format=jpg&name=...

Re: Pharo 9

#80

Post by Tepix » Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 1:24 PM UTC

frou_dh wrote: post #37

qwerty456127 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But not real HiDPI. AFAIK Windows 10 just treats FullHD (1080p) as HiDPI and scales everything up to 125% by default but I always switch it back to 100% so I have reasonable screen space capacity. If the 13-inch displays were 4K that would be HiDPI.

Traditional (~110 DPI, what Windows and MacOS were designed for) 13" resolution is 1280 or 1366. So 200% that is merely 2560+

Traditionally we had 85-100ppi monitors for example

* 15 inches 1024x768 (85ppi)

* 17 inches 1280x1024 (96ppi)

* 19 inches 1400x1050 (92ppi)

I'd argue that everything that is beyond ~140ppi needs adjustments in software and could be considered HiDPI. You could also argue that 200% scaling should be the threshold, if we're starting with 85ppi that would be 170ppi.

It also depends on the viewer distance of course. Larger displays are usually viewed from a bigger distance.