Live data from Hacker News

The vital art of talking to strangers

economist.com

141–150 of 290 posts

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#141
post #82

I dislike these kind of books, since they are designed to overcomplicate things by appealing to the mids and upper-mids needs to follow authority, defer to expertise, and use checklists and systems to try and remove any unpleasantness from interactions. "This common thing is really important! Because of science! Here is a study! Here are the health benefits! Let's also tie this into reducing climate change! I have us…

This is so true it hurts. I've wasted so much time on shitty books like this.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#142
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure you want to say that people who like comic books are hedonists? That’s an overly cut and dried argument and people aren’t nearly that simple. Isn’t it more charitable and accurate to suggest that people like what they like? I like running obscenely long distances. First, what business is it of yours how others spend their time? Second, what possibly qualifies you to claim people are hedonists because the…

Hedonist is the proper name for the philosophy. Maybe I read too much philosophy because I was merely saying the proper term in the dichotomy between virtue ethics and pleasure ethics. Maybe I should stick to talking sportsball.

Your definition of hedonism leaves a lot to be desired. There's a decent argument that even stoics are hedonists using your definition since they enjoy being stoics.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#143
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about religion per se, but about a common religion which has rituals that make people meet each other more, piercing their bubble of like-mindedness (smaller than the religion). It's like going to a supermarket makes you see people more varied than your family circle and your chosen TV show characters. (It does not nudge you to talk to these people, though.)

I am not a religious person or church goer, but are the perspectives really that different? To me, it looks like a church is a self selected group of geographically proximate people who tend to look alike and dress alike. You don't usually see much ethnic diversity in a church photo. It's more diverse than sitting at home, but I think exposure to a few TV shows has more diversity of thought, ethnicity, sexuality, etc…

I am completely behind this as a person who technically might seem like a stereotypical radical to "one side".

Empathy, the "Message of Christ", the Buddhist quest to end suffering, this is the fundamental goal and idea that drives my beliefs. The true revolution is to care for others with love.

IMO the crisis of the USA is that there is so much selfish lack of awareness or empathy everywhere.

Yes, Republicans are more famous for being psychopathic and heartless but if you think for a second that manyyy of the woke are not needlessly creul to others and uaware of certain aspects of reality than you're not seeing the full picture.

I also think we need to abandon most all labels in favor of descriptive beliefs. The label is only 50 percent effective unless it comes with 100 other labels. We are truly never even one of them in our individuality.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#144
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent a day trying to smile at strangers. The result was that half of them gave me a "do I know you?" look, and the other half looked at me like I was crazy and backed away. Not encouraging...

I remember a teacher who cycled to work every day, along a coastal route. Because he saw the same people so often, he set himself a goal to smile at all he recognised so they'd smile back. Last time we spoke, he was still battling one obstinate hold-out (while reminds me of an old joke - 'smiles' is actually the longest word in the english langugage because there's a mile between the s's).

If "smiles" is the longest, how do you explain "similes"?

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#145
I grew up as a very lonely child so I struggle a lot with talking to strangers, usually the idea way more than the practice. Knowing that I’ll have to call a stranger on the phone or go to a social event full of unknown people stresses me out to the point of often thinking of many ways of how I’d like to get out of them. In social situations I struggle to let go and have to put enormous amounts of energy to act ‘normal’, yet most people don’t even pick up on it. I guess I’m good at pretending. Despite that I don’t hate people and I quite enjoy listening to them when a topic that even mildly interests me comes up, I’ve done a lot of work to broaden my horizons so thankfully that list of topics is quite long. I often wonder if other people are even remotely like me or if all this comes easily and naturally to them at all times.

It does have the advantage that there’s no real difficulty increase between a very difficult social event or conversation or just am average one. Or I can drink quite a lot and still seem normal. I grew up thinking that I’m defective and need to keep to myself and I had to self reflect a lot to overcome that.

Despite this, I quite understand and appreciate the need for socializing, crazy amounts more than I did as a child. I wish I could teach young me that because social situations resolve conflict and create opportunities and those create a healthier all around environment and often a better future for all those involved.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you dismiss such things as mere "picking and choosing", you're unlikely to to be able to understand viewpoints to which you're inclined to disagree. You said the SBC was the largest Christian denomination. Then, when that was false, you changed it to 'largest Protestant organization'. I mean, you can restrict things down to anything to prove a point. Did you know my McDonalds down the block has the highest sales…

Right, I acknowledge your correction, so I responded with an amended statement, with emphasis on the part that I'd gotten wrong. Let me know if you'd like something more, like a written apology or something. If your argument mainly focuses on whether the SBC is the first or second largest American religious organization, then I guess you win. Congratulations! It pains me to point out something so obvious, but the SBC…

[deleted]

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#147
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally agree. Even without the opposition, there's a similar issue about having vulnerable conversations. I had a buddy over last night and he relayed an experience he had in NYC a few weeks ago. He was at a bar and saw this guy that just looked like he was in a bad place. He debated for a while whether or not to say anything but ultimately decided to break the ice and offer him a drink. The guy said he had to pace…

From my experience these sorts of conversations come much more easily in rural diners and country grocery stores than NYC bars (or at least places where people aren't generally trying to "be" someone). And it really doesn't take much tuning of any personal social instrument, just a willingness to lay one's own instrument down and enjoy the unique sound of another's.

I'm trying and failing to imagine how one would strike up a deep conversation with a stranger at a grocery store or at a diner, except maybe one of those diners that has counter seating which resembles a bar. As for the rural part, I have no idea why it would matter.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#148

I have a hypothesis that almost all of the US's current cultural problems would be solved if once a month we all cooked and shared a meal with another randomly chosen family.

Earlier on I had hopes that Facebook would implement "random friends" or "guest friends" in order to make the social graph denser and more diverse, thus making the world a better place. Not the direction things went I guess...

You can gain the acquaintance of quite a few strangers by joining groups.

My town has a general discussion Facebook page. I don't know that any of the people would recognize me on the street, but there are quite a few names I recognize now. This has been really handy since I didn't grow up here, and in small town America that often means people just won't get to know you because you "don't belong".

Also my wife is involved in several interest based groups. Mainly related to sewing and thrifting and such.

I don't know that it makes the world a better place, but it certainly can expose you to people you wouldn't otherwise ever have interacted with.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#149
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a rosy view of religion, although I accept that is your experience and perspective, and thank you for sharing it. To me, church attendance is about making the in/out group very clear. You may feel close to different political views based on your single church or flavor of Christianity, but that's still a pretty limited group. I think church membership has become undesirable because 1) fewer people believe in…

> To me, church attendance is about making the in/out group very clear. You may feel close to different political views based on your single church or flavor of Christianity, but that's still a pretty limited group. It's not really though. I mean, being Catholic (and honestly, I know so little about Protestantism that I don't really feel qualified to speak to it), there are a lot of politics in the church. In 'the Bi…

I'm an ex-Catholic and am likely one of the left leaning people you're talking about. I left the church because frankly, the actions of the church and its policies are so far from Jesus' teachings that I could no longer reconcile a belief in Christ with mother church.

> We chock it up to things like abortion and sexual ethics but I don't buy it.

Homophobia != sexual ethics.

After my goodbye confession with a good priest I'm still friends with, I never thought I'd have to say these words again. But here we go. Outright homophobia is not about sexual ethics, it's about hatred and closed mindedness. Can you point out a section a single section in the gospels that indicates that this is okay? Can you point out a single statement that Jesus made that implies there is anything wrong with being gay?? I can't, yet mother church won't cut the homophobia.

Or take the church's silly little pro life movement. Do you notice that it's directed against women? Pro lifers never take out billboards that say 'Men, don't have sex with women when they're drunk. That is called rape.' But they sure like to harass scared, pregnant women and/or people who have had abortions with their shitty propaganda. Can you show me one thing in the gospels that suggest that is okay??

You can't because it's not. None of this is okay. Jesus would not have approved of much of anything. Crap, you don't even have to read too far into Matthew to realize that Jesus would not have been accepting of any of this.

Catholics are supposed to worship a dude who stopped a woman from being stoned with the words 'let he without sin cast the first stone.' And here we are, stoning the gay, stoning the activists and stoning reproductive rights without so much as a thought about it. Has the church sinned?? Hundreds of thousands of abused children point to the fact that yeah, the church has sinned.

Who is the Catholic church to cast stones, particularly when the dude we're supposed to follow was really against casting stones? And why should I stick around something so actively disrespectful? Frankly, I'd rather find a community of people who think love is the solution rather than find a community who preaches love unless you fall into one of about 15,000 boxes.....

Edit - Here's another example that really gets my goat. My own archdiocese excommunicated a woman who was ordained as a priest. I know her, in fact, my Mom used to work with her. I even went out on a couple of dates with one of her daughters and she is an absolutely wonderful person. But mother church excommunicated her because she was ordained as a priest? Why can't she be part of the community that she helped build? She worked within Catholic churches for decades, hence her work with my Mom. She was removed from the community and the priest in her own parish read the most disgusting letter about her. Do you know why???

Her calling is not legitimate. Only a man's calling can be legitimate.

Let's assume that God in God's wisdom subscribes to the Harvard Business Review. If God had an organization with a really serious sexual abuse crisis and if God read the HBR, God might decide it makes sense to bring some women into leadership positions. But oh no, the Catholics know God. They had a direct line to God when they were abusing all those kids or ethnically cleansing Canada of its indigenous population.

I'm sorry but I can't even write this shit with a straight face. How is a woman's calling totally irrelevant to a point of excommunication when men can fuck children and just get moved to a new parish (for the 17th time)?

Serious question.

Re: The vital art of talking to strangers

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a religious person or church goer, but are the perspectives really that different? To me, it looks like a church is a self selected group of geographically proximate people who tend to look alike and dress alike. You don't usually see much ethnic diversity in a church photo. It's more diverse than sitting at home, but I think exposure to a few TV shows has more diversity of thought, ethnicity, sexuality, etc…

I am completely behind this as a person who technically might seem like a stereotypical radical to "one side". Empathy, the "Message of Christ", the Buddhist quest to end suffering, this is the fundamental goal and idea that drives my beliefs. The true revolution is to care for others with love. IMO the crisis of the USA is that there is so much selfish lack of awareness or empathy everywhere. Yes, Republicans are mo…

I keep mentioning this video because it's just so good, but Roger Scruton argued that the world has turned selfish and with it we've lost beauty, which in turns means life has lost its meaning. It's a powerful, profound view and one that I can't shake off my head ever since watching it.

> Our language, our music and our manners are increasingly raucous, self-centered, and offensive, as though beauty and good taste have no real place in our lives. > One word is written large on all these ugly things, and that word is “me.” > My profits, my desires, my pleasures. > And art has nothing to say in response to this except, “Yeah, go for it!” > I think we are losing beauty and with it there is the danger that we will lose the meaning of life.

https://vimeo.com/128428182

https://orthosphere.wordpress.com/2017/09/16/roger-scruton-w...

Post reply on HN