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Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

monodraw.helftone.com

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Re: Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

#51

Post by ajford »

robertoandred wrote: post #48
ajford wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be interested to hear as to why you couldn't achieve the functionality of this app in Electron. I agree with you that it's almost impossible to get a native UI feel in electron, but that's not always the first priority. If the end goal of the application is to present a custom interface for drawing on a monospace grid for ASCII art, I'm not sure I see the argument that a native UI is necessary over any cross-plat…

One example: native document-based Mac apps have file handling functionality in the window's titlebar (rename, move, tag, etc). It's very convenient. Electron apps don't. Another: native Mac apps by default reopen where you left off. Open windows, open documents, etc. Electron doesn't get this functionality automatically; you could spend time recreating it, but it still would integrate with native settings. Another s…

That's less of why the app couldn't be written in Electron and more of why Mac users wouldn't like an Electron app.

Perfectly valid reason why someone would want to write their app as a native app though, and I appreciate that.

Some of those are definitely things Electron gets wrong and should correct. Handling system-wide accent colors is exactly the kind of thing my UI kit (Electron in this argument) should be handling and not forcing everyone to re-invent.

I've never used or even heard of the titlebar file handling functionality and had to search that right now. This is exactly the kind of thing I've said about discoverability. I used OSX for three years daily, and I've been using it on and off as needed since around 2010. Some things that people love and use all the time are just not obvious to everyone.

Re: Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

#53

Post by calvin_ »

ajford wrote: post #9
GekkePrutser wrote: post #2

This looks really cool. Well done! And no electron. Will definitely try it out

I get the hate that Electron gets for it's weight and overhead, but this is a perfect example of why Electron has value. This app has no dependency on native OS for anything beyond writing data. It doesn't need to compile heavy code bases, it doesn't need fast GPU or other access. It could have very well been an electron app, and it would have the benefit of being widely available on many platforms. I'd love to be ab…

I think you underestimate a lot of the APIs for a platform and how they influence an app; Cocoa provides a lot for an application; for example, it can provide a lot of the structure for a document related app in terms of i.e undo/redo, window management, etc.

Re: Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

#54

Post by dang »

FWIW, this looks like a follow up to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27831789 (Svgbob – Create a graphical representation of text diagrams)

Some past threads:

Show HN: Monodraw, an ASCII Art Editor for Mac - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9545252 - May 2015 (53 comments)

Monodraw: Powerful ASCII Art Editor for Developers (Mac) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9145945 - March 2015 (3 comments)

Show HN: Monodraw for Mac, ASCII Art Editor – Beta Available - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9138039 - March 2015 (11 comments)

ASCII art editor designed for the Mac - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8445087 - Oct 2014 (107 comments)

Re: Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

#55

Post by npunt »

ajford wrote: post #46
haswell wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One potential conclusion: Mac users understand the productivity increase and the value of apps feeling native, since the Apple ecosystem is one of the primary places to get such a native experience today. This shouldn't necessarily be interpreted as "Mac users are special flowers", but rather, "Mac users may have stronger opinions about this because they've experienced the benefits of native apps". I've been around t…

Another take on it is that Mac decided to go a different path on a few different UI things in the past, and that has persisted to this day. Look at how *nix, Windows, Sun, BSD, Chrome OS (which is basically a linux anyways) all use Ctrl, Meta (alt), and Shift for their hotkeys, compared to how Mac uses Hyper (cmd). Also look at how Mac has one instance of an app's tool bar/menu that all windows share. I'll agree that…

You've got the order reversed. Mac pretty much defined the modern WIMP UI and was the only real game in town for consumers & professionals from 1984 - 1990 when Windows 3 was released, and during this time an entire industry (DTP) was built atop Mac's strong UI foundations.

It's more accurate to say that in modern UIs the others decided to each go their own different paths and replicate part of what made the MacOS experience special, but they also tended to forget to include a lot of the little details that made it great, and have never had the same dedication to consistency.

Re: discoverability, there's an order to discovering advanced options in MacOS - hold Option and click on menus. You'll be surprised how far that gets you. The whole idea of MacOS and native apps is you learn how to use the system once, and you're rewarded from thereon out. Not all things are discoverable without these keys because not all things are relevant for everyday uses and can add clutter - its a design choice to make simple things easy and hard things possible. They're not always perfect but they're still the best game in town.

RE: moving windows with hotkeys, just get an app like Magnet, problem solved.

Re: Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

#57

Post by webwielder2 »

This is why I love the Mac. Even obscure apps have a beautiful interface and easy to use web site. I know this is incendiary, but I must say it: on Windows, this app's site would have seven giant, fake download buttons, the actual download would play an ad, and the app would look like something from a fever dream.

Re: Monodraw: ASCII art editor for the Mac

#59

Post by mortenjorck »

Corun wrote: post #21
jshier wrote: post #8

Unfortunately in minimal maintenance mode for the last 3 years. https://blog.helftone.com/monodraw-maintenance-mode/ Still works well though.

In reality it is still maintained though I think. They released an update to bring native Apple Silicon support for example: https://blog.helftone.com/monodraw-v1.5-apple-silicon-macos-...

The post even mentions a Big Sur / Monterey visual refresh currently in development. As "maintenance mode" projects go, this looks like the best of the best.
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