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A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

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Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#21

Post by mixmastamyk »

tomc1985 wrote: post #15
andrewzah wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you on vulgarity but life isn't really fair about this. Just like how wearing a suit unfairly makes a presentation more potent than casual wear. It is what it is. Being vulgar (even if technically justified) weakens the message for many people, especially when the other party is very polite and professional in return. edit: I would prefer if people weren't like that, but that's just one of the many flaws…

I understand your point but I think that emotional suppression is a much greater crime than failing to be polite. After all, politeness has quite a storied history in being used to suppress and control people that are used to being 'othered', many of which feel things that are much stronger than I am expressing here

Agreed. If these folks are assholes, I want to hear the truth.

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#22

Post by tomc1985 »

andrewzah wrote: post #16
tomc1985 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand your point but I think that emotional suppression is a much greater crime than failing to be polite. After all, politeness has quite a storied history in being used to suppress and control people that are used to being 'othered', many of which feel things that are much stronger than I am expressing here

"politeness has quite a storied history in being used to suppress and control people" As I said, it's not fair. I agree with you that it shouldn't be that way. But I also accept the fact that that's how things are, unfortunately. Life isn't fair. Maybe someday humans will be better, but I think not. And this is getting off-tangent from dealing with the problem at hand.

I can afford not to care. Sure in situations resembling servility I might have to revert to a more polite manner of speaking, but I make great effort to avoid them as they are debasing.

A lot of the folks here on HN are responsible for the current reality of tech. A nice polite discussion is great but I want to express strong feelings and make people feel bad for their choices. And politely debating the merits of something does not do that.

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#23

Post by hkt »

cusenses wrote: post #19
tenebrisalietum wrote: post #11

Want a Web run by human beings again? Want tracking methods impossible to implement in any meaningful fashion by design? Try Gemini. Gemini is here and can be used TODAY. https://gemini.circumlunar.space/ The only thing standing between you and the next web is... a lot, but try it anyway, things have to start somewhere.

What prevents Gemini from being taken over and utilized just like the current web has been?

Governance is the only thing that can. There are no technical measures that can prevent it.

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#24

Post by skymt »

cusenses wrote: post #19
tenebrisalietum wrote: post #11

Want a Web run by human beings again? Want tracking methods impossible to implement in any meaningful fashion by design? Try Gemini. Gemini is here and can be used TODAY. https://gemini.circumlunar.space/ The only thing standing between you and the next web is... a lot, but try it anyway, things have to start somewhere.

What prevents Gemini from being taken over and utilized just like the current web has been?

The Gemini protocol is intended to exclude features that could be used for tracking. It has no cookies, user-agent, referer, etc and the protocol is not extensible enough that such features could be easily added.

Also, frankly, the spartan design of native Gemini pages (very limited formatting, no scripts or even inline images!) means that the circle of nerds who use Gemini will almost certainly remain too small to catch the eye of ad-tech. It's hostile to commerce in a way I find kind of delightful.

https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#25

Post by tannhaeuser »

> On the other side are companies that use cross-site tracking for things like website optimization and advertising, and are fighting for their industry's very survival. That includes small firms like Rosewell's, but also giants of the industry, like Facebook.

The Rosewell guy may not be a saint, but omitting Google from the list as the ones standing to win from privacy features, through ga and the usage they have over the Web via Chrome anyway is completely missing the point of a single party having monopolistic control over click data.

Can't also agree with the characterization of the W3C in TFA.

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#27

Post by allturtles »

tomc1985 wrote: post #15
andrewzah wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you on vulgarity but life isn't really fair about this. Just like how wearing a suit unfairly makes a presentation more potent than casual wear. It is what it is. Being vulgar (even if technically justified) weakens the message for many people, especially when the other party is very polite and professional in return. edit: I would prefer if people weren't like that, but that's just one of the many flaws…

I understand your point but I think that emotional suppression is a much greater crime than failing to be polite. After all, politeness has quite a storied history in being used to suppress and control people that are used to being 'othered', many of which feel things that are much stronger than I am expressing here

Great, politeness is racist now?

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#29

Post by tomc1985 »

allturtles wrote: post #27
tomc1985 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand your point but I think that emotional suppression is a much greater crime than failing to be polite. After all, politeness has quite a storied history in being used to suppress and control people that are used to being 'othered', many of which feel things that are much stronger than I am expressing here

Great, politeness is racist now?

I don't think that politeness is inherently racist, but it has been used as a tool of racial suppression, and as a way of keeping itinerants in line

https://www.ferris.edu/HTMLS/news/jimcrow/question/2006/sept...

Re: A privacy war is raging inside the W3C

#30

Post by coldtea »

mistrial9 wrote: post #6
tomc1985 wrote: post #5

I don't care how big this man's business is, Rosewell is a parasite bent on preserving the established order of datamining the shit out of everyone for his own personal profit. He is gumming up the works with pointless philosophical bloviating, using the anti-big-tech argument as a cudgel of convenience for bludgeoning a nascent privacy movement that has taken decades to get off the ground. I've sat in a large audien…

agree with the sentiment but the vulgarity dilutes the weight of the message.. centuries of privacy rights are drained and drowning right now IMO

>but the vulgarity dilutes the weight of the message

Actually vulgarity was invented (and has historically been used) to improve the weight of such messages. It works too:

"Writing in the journal Social Psychological and Personality Science a team of researchers from the Netherlands, the UK, the USA and Hong Kong report that people who use profanity are less likely to be associated with lying and deception." [1]

Can't argue with fucking science.

[1] https://phys.org/news/2017-01-links-honesty.html

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