Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#31

Post by threatofrain » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:32 PM UTC

abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

Apple Maps with the upcoming iOS 15 will also be changing their GUI a bit. I don't think apps should be frozen in time, but at the same time, I'm not sure how it can be updated safely given how human psychology works (people will fiddle with their phones while driving).

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#32

Post by whimsicalism » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:33 PM UTC

tasogare wrote: post #28

admax88q wrote: post #14

macOS takes the same approach with Finder however. Managing files in macOS is a huge pain if you want to keep it in some nicely organized tree. Its optimized for just searching to find what you're looking for. It presents all files in a flat list by default. Apple's primary business model is not search, so there could be some evidence that more people just prefer search over tags/folders/icons etc.

There is tons if options to find files on macOS: the find command, spotlight, search in the finder, hierarchical view in the finder. Which popular OS has a better system than that?

The search on MacOS is unusable for me. It always surfaces wrong/irrelevant things and defaults to searching in the oddest places.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#33

Post by RC_ITR » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:33 PM UTC

riffic wrote: post #22

abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

> it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend This wouldn't have been accidental, it would have been fully your own fault for negligence. I'll fully admit this is a pedantic tangent but it's been long acknowledged that "accident" is a problematic word to describe vehicle crashes because it minimizes the agency of a driver and intentional decision making processes that lead up to a crash (for instance, using…

This comment is not the way to win that culture war.

Agree that using phones while driving is generally bad, but implying that it is irresponsible to use turn-by-turn (and suggesting the alternative of just knowing where you are) is just more likely to make people ignore the problem all together.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#34

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:34 PM UTC

cunthorpe wrote: post #23

jarofgreen wrote: post #15

Flip side - Google Keep. To search for a note you have to press the search box twice . First time you just get types of things - if you want to search free text you have to press again. I'd argue that UI encourages using tags over search. It's honestly my only major annoyance about Google Keep.

Reminds me of Google Maps. Me: I want a coffee shop. Maps: Ok let me zoom out and show you coffee shops in a 20km radius. So you have to zoom back in and “Search this area”. But hey the Starbucks next door is not shown, it’s maddening. Google’s core business is now ads, not search.

[deleted]

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#35

Post by overscore » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:34 PM UTC

cunthorpe wrote: post #23

jarofgreen wrote: post #15

Flip side - Google Keep. To search for a note you have to press the search box twice . First time you just get types of things - if you want to search free text you have to press again. I'd argue that UI encourages using tags over search. It's honestly my only major annoyance about Google Keep.

Reminds me of Google Maps. Me: I want a coffee shop. Maps: Ok let me zoom out and show you coffee shops in a 20km radius. So you have to zoom back in and “Search this area”. But hey the Starbucks next door is not shown, it’s maddening. Google’s core business is now ads, not search.

> Google’s core business is now ads, not search.

It has been for over 20 years now, since October 2000.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#36

Post by UI_at_80x24 » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:34 PM UTC

Could we use this as a place to suggest alternatives to Google Maps?

I have tried OpenStreetMaps (albeit 5+years ago) and couldn't search for an address. So if that's improved I'd like to know.

I don't need/want "find X near me" or fluff like "what restaurant's are open right now?".

All I want is navigation between current location and target address.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#37

Post by ChrisArchitect » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:34 PM UTC

ad for a bookmark manager?

Does anyone have an idea about the userbase of Bookmarks? Maybe it's actually reallllllly low and this isn't worth anyone but power users' time.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#38

Post by benatkin » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:35 PM UTC

riffic wrote: post #22

abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

> it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend This wouldn't have been accidental, it would have been fully your own fault for negligence. I'll fully admit this is a pedantic tangent but it's been long acknowledged that "accident" is a problematic word to describe vehicle crashes because it minimizes the agency of a driver and intentional decision making processes that lead up to a crash (for instance, using…

> It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#39

Post by pydry » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:36 PM UTC

the_lonely_road wrote: post #29

pydry wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>typical big-co reason a product gets little iteration. That they DGAF if they're not facing competition. IE6 was the same. Threaten them with loss of market share and they'll fix these things.

I think you have that backwards. It takes a strong stomach to claim Google isn't facing competition on Google Sheets and threatening their market share would cause them to start caring. The more likely scenario is they have given up on winning any market share as serious users refuse to switch from Excel and non serious users have pads of paper and pencil, leaving Google just a tiny slice of the pie between those two…

I was thinking of chrome bookmarks.

I wouldnt put google sheets in the same category. I think it has been improved over the years (perhaps not as much as it should have).

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#40

Post by zamfi » Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 8:36 PM UTC

riffic wrote: post #22

abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

> it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend This wouldn't have been accidental, it would have been fully your own fault for negligence. I'll fully admit this is a pedantic tangent but it's been long acknowledged that "accident" is a problematic word to describe vehicle crashes because it minimizes the agency of a driver and intentional decision making processes that lead up to a crash (for instance, using…

> it's been long acknowledged that "accident" is a problematic word to describe vehicle crashes because it minimizes the agency of a driver and intentional decision making processes that lead up to a crash

I seem to recall that this was intentional, to improve acceptance of motor vehicles in the early days.

Certainly the way laws are written, there is quite a high bar before an "accident" brings the kinds of criminal charges that any other reason for a similar action would trigger. For example, if you kill someone through inattention, that is often charged as involuntary manslaughter, unless you did it with a car and were following traffic laws, in which case it is rarely charged.

As a society we have traditionally come to accept that driving kills lots of people, often but not always at random, and we don't want to be handing out random prison sentences for those with merely bad luck. (Or, at least, without provable blame.)

I suspect there will be backlash, your post is one example.