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People Staring at Computers

kylemcdonald.net

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Re: People Staring at Computers

#81

Post by MrGilbert »

loosescrews wrote: post #74
angry_octet wrote: post #21

The fact that a number of posters feel offended that he would 'install software that takes their picture without consent' simply highlights how necessary such art is -- most people have simply no idea how many times they are photographed each day without their consent. An artist taking a few pictures, in an incredibly public place, should barely stir a ripple in comparison. Consider if software had not been 'installe…

> At least now we can wear masks. I sure hope this remains socially acceptable, but the way things are going, I don't think this will last in the US. I am aware that the first SARS outbreak left a mask wearing culture in parts of Asia, but American culture is pretty different. I was optimistic mask wearing would remain in American culture, but the last month or so has changed my mind. Mask usage in my area has been r…

> I think this may be the only 1.5 year long stretch of time I haven't gotten sick.

Yeah, same. This, plus work from home really helps to not get thrown all sorts of viruses at you. But in my company, wfh has come to an end, and nobody is wearing masks around here. Can't wait to catch my first cold since the start of the pandemic.

Re: People Staring at Computers

#82

Post by paxys »

> In the end, if Apple hadn't so vehemently condemned the piece, it would have been resigned to live as just another quick F.A.T. Lab project, and part of my ongoing curiosity exploring computer-mediated interaction. But because they had the project taken offline, and my computer confiscated, Apple managed to give it more attention than I could have ever attracted. The reporters using headlines with "artist" in scare quotes got the media artists mad. The censorship and search warrant got the freedom of speech people mad. The feeling of privacy invasion, or just the awareness of surveillance, took care of everyone else. Apple created an amazing discussion I never could have planned.

Sounds about right

Re: People Staring at Computers

#83

Post by jonas21 »

simion314 wrote: post #63
yupper32 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not many are offended about taking pictures. What people should be offended by is that so many people on here think it's totally acceptable to install spyware onto computers without the owner's consent. This isn't some kind of whistleblower situation. This is someone fucking around and installing spyware. That's illegal! There's no grey area here, regardless of the lack of action by the AG.

>That's illegal! Any theories why nothing happened in the end if this is clearly illegal? Maybe because it was a public place, people were already recorded by at least Apple security cameras? Or maybe the law did not applied in this exact case?

IANAL, but they were considering prosecuting him under Title 18, U.S. Code 1030 [1]. According to the law, simply accessing a computer without authorization is not a crime. You also need to do one of several other things -- one of which is causing "damage and loss" (see section (5)(C)).

It sounds like the Secret Service was saying that he caused damage and loss because Apple had to remove his software from their computers. But perhaps the prosecutor disagreed or felt it would be hard to convince a jury.

[1] https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1030

Re: People Staring at Computers

#84

Post by yupper32 »

SirSourdough wrote: post #75
yupper32 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not many are offended about taking pictures. What people should be offended by is that so many people on here think it's totally acceptable to install spyware onto computers without the owner's consent. This isn't some kind of whistleblower situation. This is someone fucking around and installing spyware. That's illegal! There's no grey area here, regardless of the lack of action by the AG.

I don't see a major functional difference between installing the spyware and taking the pictures with an open browser tab, a Facetime call to yourself, or a long lens from outside the store. It's hard for me to see those things as rising to the level of criminality on a publicly accessible computer in a public space, so it's hard for me to be offended just because installed software was used to achieve the same ends.…

> I don't see a major functional difference between installing the spyware and taking the pictures with an open browser tab, a Facetime call to yourself, or a long lens from outside the store.

That's troubling.

How would you react if I installed spyware on one of your devices that constantly took pictures of you, but only when you were out in public? Do you think I should face any sort of punishment?

If you're not on my side of the argument with that example, then I think you really need to take a step back and think about all this.

Re: People Staring at Computers

#85

Post by uncomputation »

angry_octet wrote: post #21

The fact that a number of posters feel offended that he would 'install software that takes their picture without consent' simply highlights how necessary such art is -- most people have simply no idea how many times they are photographed each day without their consent. An artist taking a few pictures, in an incredibly public place, should barely stir a ripple in comparison. Consider if software had not been 'installe…

> Consider if software had not been 'installed', but the browser left logged into a Zoom call

There’s a difference between someone tripping and someone being pushed down. Usually when people are photographed throughout the day without their consent it’s in the background of someone else’s picture accidentally or via security cameras, not part of some public art installation showing off their “computer face” when they go to an Apple store because some guy wants to make a point about “computer mediated communication.”

Re: People Staring at Computers

#86

Post by yupper32 »

quenix wrote: post #78
yupper32 wrote: post #46

They installed spyware on someone else's computers. Of course that's illegal, regardless of whether or not the AG decided to go after them. Are people serious here? There's nothing ethical or legal going on with the blog post here. The fact that they got off is just luck. There's no whistleblowing or any other protection granted, and there shouldn't be. Period. And the worst part in my opinion is the author has no in…

Wow. I found a video of this exhibition on YouTube, and it looks like what this guy installed is less pure spyware and more a remote administration tool (RAT). After he took the photos he wanted, he remotely uploaded them to every computer and forced them to be shown on-screen while people were browsing around the demo. Freaky stuff. How is installing RATs on other peoples’ computers even remotely ethical?

For real. People here are treating them with whistleblower gloves. There's nothing of that sort going on here. Just unethical, horrible stuff.

Re: People Staring at Computers

#87

Post by ggm »

Has a strong vibe of "I never asked myself if I should do something, having discovered that I could do something" which is ever-present in a lot of creative work. The self-censorship implicit in "should" tends to make people go no, but sometimes, you do have to wonder if yes might have been better. (yes as in Yes, I should think twice about doing this)

Its not "piss christ" (Serrano) or Jyllands-Posten Muhammad cartoons, but it has a similar vibe to me: The transgressive quality of what he did, obviously partly appealed. The consequences of annoying people didn't, until was too late. Now in the case of Serrano and Jyllands-Posten, one was just being offensive to make a point, the other paid the ultimate price.

What if e.g. it was "accidentally outing US secret forces because you map where fitbit are via the GPS leak"

Re: People Staring at Computers

#89

Post by yarcob »

The most curious thing about this project is how people seem to have a visceral reaction to having photos of them made without their permission; but having their activity tracked online hardly evokes the same reaction.

It's weird. What harm is a random picture of my face in public going to do? But still some people worry so much about that.

Whereas only very few people show the same reaction to the fact that Google stores a copy of every word you typed into their search field ever. Or that Apple stores a copy of every message I have sent to a loved one with my phone on their servers.

We accept that our most private thoughts are being captured, analyzed, sold; but the outrage is about someone taking an anonymous photo of us in a public setting.

Re: People Staring at Computers

#90

Post by 2Gkashmiri »

in Kashmir at least, there is a big thing about "Six months later, I still get nervous when I hear an unexpected knock."

this late night knocking has been connected with bad omen because for the past 30 odd years, many homes have gotten bad news of their loved ones being killed or they having disappeared.

that said, if you have to go to a neighbour house, or a friends house, you never just go and knock. people might faint or have a heart attack. instead you call first or just wait till morning.

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