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9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

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Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#71

Post by sixtofour »

derleth wrote: post #58
WalterBright wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>A much better take would be an examination of why our education system churns out so many college grads with few marketable skills. Queue the recent discussion about rampant cheating in college. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2774254

> Queue I'd understand this better if people didn't always pick the longer word when the short one would be correct.

An indication that you edited this would have been helpful. My other reply to you makes less sense now.

Yours in helpfulness, -- sixtofour

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#72

Post by natmaster »

jameskilton wrote: post #34
natmaster wrote: post #29

This is why I'm so against the luddite regulations of liberals - they stagnate innovation. Obsession over jobs is a terrible mentality - restructuring is extremely healthy and necessary part of economic growth, and trying to stop it is only going to hurt things. People should be learning skills that are actually useful instead of doing robotic tasks all their lives. Robots will soon be replacing robotic people.

Your statement is disjointed and impossible to follow. Both parties are obsessing over jobs, and both parties have different ways to "fix" this problem. If you want to discuss regulations, lets discuss how the lack of regulation led to the housing bubble and the near collapse of our entire economy. If you want to talk about "robotic" jobs, please discuss how this is supposed to change? Do you want the government to p…

No straw men please.

I don't care about political parties, why is this suddenly a political discussion about what the government should do? I said the government should stop stifling innovation, not stifle it in a different manner.

If people don't want a job that's their problem, not mine. I don't see why I should be worrying about people not interested in their own prosperity.

And wow, way to make blanket statements that are backed by the same hokus pokus logic that lead to the housing bubble. Maybe instead of listening to the loonies that said our economy was doing great, you should listen to the people that actually were trying to stop the housing bubbled before it happened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#73

Post by enjo »

MatthewPhillips wrote: post #61
muhfuhkuh wrote: post #54

IMO, the problem is much more than just automation and advancement in technology. It's actually far graver, and maybe inexorable at least in the short term. Hate the man or his policies (or both), but you can't deny President Obama's observation that training education is the real problem in the so-called "jobless recovery". America as it currently stands has a total, almost prideful disregard for education (public a…

I agree with everything you said but the #1 obstacle to owning you own business is seed capital. You don't have to be a genius or rich to start a company, but you do have to be willing to take a potentially big financial risk to do so. People fresh out of college don't have 20k to live off of for 6 months before they can turn a profit on a business. The average household has 10k+ in debt; those people cannot start a…

I agree with you, but I think it's more dire than what you are painting. I'd rephrase something more like this:

People fresh out of college (most of whom are already carrying a 5-figure debt) don't have $60k to live off of for the 18-months before they (might) turn a profit.

I've been around VERY few businesses that were profitable at 6 months. Either you are digging out from the high initial capital costs (like a restaurant) or you're actually having to build the thing you want to sell. Going from inception to profitability in 6 months would be, at least by my estimation, remarkable.

Building products and launching services takes time. If we want to encourage entrepreneurs, we should be focused on getting them over those initial hurdles.

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#74

Post by ScottBurson »

derleth wrote: post #58
WalterBright wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>A much better take would be an examination of why our education system churns out so many college grads with few marketable skills. Queue the recent discussion about rampant cheating in college. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2774254

> Queue I'd understand this better if people didn't always pick the longer word when the short one would be correct.

Thanks for revising your comment. Unfortunately I had already downvoted it.

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#75

Post by MatthewPhillips »

kotrin wrote: post #69
MatthewPhillips wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with everything you said but the #1 obstacle to owning you own business is seed capital. You don't have to be a genius or rich to start a company, but you do have to be willing to take a potentially big financial risk to do so. People fresh out of college don't have 20k to live off of for 6 months before they can turn a profit on a business. The average household has 10k+ in debt; those people cannot start a…

I don't think seed money is the problem. You start a company in the cloud using basic plans that total to $0/month.

How do you pay your own wage?

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#76

Post by protomyth »

gaius wrote: post #70
muhfuhkuh wrote: post #54

IMO, the problem is much more than just automation and advancement in technology. It's actually far graver, and maybe inexorable at least in the short term. Hate the man or his policies (or both), but you can't deny President Obama's observation that training education is the real problem in the so-called "jobless recovery". America as it currently stands has a total, almost prideful disregard for education (public a…

EXACTLY the same problem in the UK. Under the last government's social engineering caper, millions of teenagers who would otherwise have learned a trade (electrician, plumber, carpenter, etc) from their fathers instead were swindled into going to hastily built "new universities" to get worthless, made-up degrees in "Media Studies" (and a mountain of debt). Now they're not only unemployed but unemployable - and all ou…

Right now ND is importing welders and other skilled tradesmen from Canada. They just cannot get enough people. This whole "push people to get a real education" is a crock. People need to get the education (be it vocational or academic) that allows them to have a career that satisfies them, and not some weird perception of the world.

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#77

Post by derleth »

john_b wrote: post #66
derleth wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Queue I'd understand this better if people didn't always pick the longer word when the short one would be correct.

"The most important principle on HN, though, is to make thoughtful comments. Thoughtful in both senses: both civil and substantial." "Empty comments can be ok if they're positive. There's nothing wrong with submitting a comment saying just "Thanks." What we especially discourage are comments that are empty and negative—comments that are mere name-calling." http://ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

I am trying to be helpful: I'm trying to help someone learn English. How is that negative?

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#78

Post by derleth »

sixtofour wrote: post #67
derleth wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Queue I'd understand this better if people didn't always pick the longer word when the short one would be correct.

I have seen grammar and spelling comments given in the spirit of helpfulness, but this was not one of them, and adds nothing. My comment adds very little more than that, but I'd like to remind people that many very smart engineers and business workers have a terrible grasp of formal English, yet they get the job done and more. WalterBright's comment was short, but pointed to more information, and was a potentially us…

So attempting to help someone learn English isn't helpful? That seems odd.

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#79

Post by jbooth »

jfoutz wrote: post #26
PaulHoule wrote: post #10

Technological unemployment is part of the picture, but there isn't a 'magic bullet' to avoid it. We need Scientists? Ask the 1800 surplus Physics PhD's that get produced every year. It's clear that the academic system uses young and smart people, but not that it produces desirable or permanent employment for them. A wise person wouldn't get involved, unless they've got one (or preferably two) parent(s) that are alrea…

Scientists are just like Machine learning pixie dust. It's fun to say, but you'd be hard pressed to find a small business that needs an astrophysicist. I don't mean to pick on astrophysicists by the way, pick any random phd, a small business probably doesn't need that.

A very large number of those 2 million unfillable jobs mentioned above are for basically "Someone who knows linear algebra and statistics really well."

Scientists fit the bill -- any physics phd who can't find a job can join the finance or ad tech industries by sending out a single resume.

Re: 9.2% Unemployment? Blame Microsoft.

#80

Post by sixtofour »

In a reply elsewhere here, I said "people do need to suck it up and learn new skills."

How many people know how to learn new skills, or are able to recognize quickly that they need to do so?

Is that a missing element in our education? You spend 12 years drinking what they're selling, and then suddenly you're expected to know how to re-tool yourself.

Shouldn't education be structured in part to teach and reinforce self re-tooling, and even grade on that ability?

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