Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

sixthtone.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

361–370 of 451 posts

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#361

Post by wrycoder »

russli1993 wrote: post #254
gentleman11 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This company has a stake in many American companies. How chilling

Tencent is doing this to comply to Chinese laws. They won't do this if there is no such law. And the law says: "internet gaming companies have responsibility to not provide internet gaming service to minors between 10pm and 8am". I am sure tencent won't want to do this if they had the chance. 1) it limits their ability to get play time and sell to kids. 2) its more work on their end. So the main problem here is the l…

> They won't do this if there is no such law.

They will, if they can make money doing it.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#362

Post by allochthon »

Technology, surveillance and privacy in China is an ongoing topic of interest here and in news outlets. (Obviously it's a topic that's of interest in relation to other places as well.) The excesses of one generation can lead to the reforms of a subsequent one, and I'm curious whether there will be a counter-reaction among young people in China if at some point they perceive a line to have been crossed, and where that line might be.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#363

Post by losvedir »

Horrifying usage aside... I'm curious about the tech here as it relates to structural bias.

In the US there are frequent stories about how ML works well on white men, but not, e.g., African Americans and I think Asian Americans. There was that Twitter spat between Timnit Gebru and Andrej Karpathy about this subject, and whether it's "just" training data or inherent in ML, partly because of who runs the analyses and who the wealthy consumers are, etc. Having trained some models and fiddled with hyperparameters myself, I could see the argument that it's a little more than just the training data; for example, how the algorithm uses contrast or what kind of angles it picks up.

But what I'm curious about is how well this system works here, developed by a Chinese company with Chinese developers for primarily Chinese users. Does it have better accuracy than Google on the same Chinese data set? Does it have worse accuracy on white people than Google?

I imagine the data is not out there, but maybe there's some published research along these lines by Tencent, or others comparing algorithms or models trained on Tencent data sets to the western equivalents?

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#364

Post by wrycoder »

nickysielicki wrote: post #143
hulitu wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the first time. All smartfones have a microfone and a camera. And if you think that they are used only for making pictures and talking on the phone - dream on.

Don’t you think someone — possibly a user of this site — would have noticed the network traffic? Not only are you implying that there is a back door in the phone operating systems, but also in every other device on the same network as the phone to hide such traffic. What you’re suggesting is certainly possible , but the idea that it’s been rolled out to the average person doesn’t seem likely.

Isn't it suspected that, at least with a warrant, the police in the US can request that a phone's mic be turned on, even when the phone is asleep?

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#365

Post by viro »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #342
calsy wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you trying to convince us leaving kids unsupervised in car parks is no big deal? You walk with the child in hand or if you're really concerned just pick them up. Point is there is a responsible parent who is watching and looking after the kids. Parenting isn't easy, its annoying to take kids in for short trip to shops, but you just have to do it.

If there are multiple kids, it is clearly more risky to walk them through a busy parking lot. Edit. For those interested in the risk analysis side: “ On average, 38 children under the age of 15 die each year from heatstroke after being left in a vehicle. Nearly every state has experienced at least one death since 1998. In both 2018 and 2019 a record number of 53 children died after being left in a hot vehicle.” .. “…

Well first risk analysis doesn't work like that. Second leaving ur kids unsupervised in a car is illegal in most states here. Hell in most states it's legal for me to break your car window if you do that to a freaking dog. so yea ur so wrong I'm pretty sure you're trolling us.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#366

Post by CryptoPunk »

rowanG077 wrote: post #286
CryptoPunk wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that at all comparable to this situation? That is putting in toxic ingredients that the buyer is not informed about. That's false advertising, fraud and criminal negligence. This is a company offering a game with terms of services clearly spelled out to you, with you free to accept or reject their offer with full knowledge of what they are offering. >>A collection of people not providing you with food on your…

I didn't say the buyer is not informed about it. You completely made that up. It's on the back in small print with the chemical name just like all other ingredients. Besides that I think that your viewpoint is completely nuts and no well functioning society could exist like that.

>>It's on the back in small print with the chemical name just like all other ingredients.

So they are not informed. No court would consider that sufficient disclosure of a poison additive. Common law can't be evaded by resorting to technicalities as in your caricature.

Its basis is informed consent, and that incorporates all of the context that goes into making a determination of whether that's present, including custom, reasonable assumptions, etc.

Notice what distinguishes your "fine print" hypothetical from the scenario I described:

This is a company offering a game with terms of services clearly spelled out to you, with you free to accept or reject their offer with full knowledge of what they are offering.

Note: "clearly spelled out to you" and "full knowledge of what they are offering"

Not "fine print", with the implication that no one is reading it.

>>Besides that I think that your viewpoint is completely nuts and no well functioning society could exist like that.

You have not explained why you think this, so this is not a particularly constructive track of discussion.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#367

Post by calsy »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #342
calsy wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you trying to convince us leaving kids unsupervised in car parks is no big deal? You walk with the child in hand or if you're really concerned just pick them up. Point is there is a responsible parent who is watching and looking after the kids. Parenting isn't easy, its annoying to take kids in for short trip to shops, but you just have to do it.

If there are multiple kids, it is clearly more risky to walk them through a busy parking lot. Edit. For those interested in the risk analysis side: “ On average, 38 children under the age of 15 die each year from heatstroke after being left in a vehicle. Nearly every state has experienced at least one death since 1998. In both 2018 and 2019 a record number of 53 children died after being left in a hot vehicle.” .. “…

Nothing to do with risk, everything to do with supervision. A person sees a child in a car alone, they don't create a risk assessment with instant access to available stats in their brain. They see a child alone and immediately think 'where are their parents?'. When you see those horror stories in the news a person's first thought is 'where are their parents?'. Regardless of the overall risk, people will always ask 'where are the parents?'. You've obviously experienced the negative consequences of these actions and are attempting to prove in whatever way that leaving the kids unsupervised is the best option, but that is generally not acceptable in the wider community.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#368

Post by w0de0 »

sudosysgen wrote: post #349
mensetmanusman wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But there is superiority; I have a colleague from China who accidentally pulled out their phone to read news while within sight where there was a protest going on. They were then visited on the weekend for eight hours for intense interviews to make sure he wasn’t involved in the ‘government criticism’. He says this is a regular situation. If you think this is a routine thing in America, you might be mistaken, but it…

Certainly, the actual act of being visited by your government is something that wouldn't happen in the US. The difference is that of intent. The US government isn't fine with you protesting because they respect your right to threaten the power of the interests they represent, it's because they know that your protest will do literally nothing to threaten them. Wheras in China, the government is much more susceptible t…

In your view, protest never leads to change in America?

In your view, citizens of the US never visit or are visited by agents of some level of government?

In your view, the US government is not the collection of disparate power bases we see but actually a hidden monolithic “they,” with a discrete “intent” that is a composition of unspecified but doubtless nefarious interest groups?

In your view, China’s government is susceptible to radical yet peaceful change because of organized protest?

In your view, China’s government would never suppress organized protest? Or - perhaps - it suppresses protest because it would lead to change, and your view is that this is a more honest tyranny, echoing the Lincoln quote?

In your view, American local and federal governments have never reformed themselves, the variance of state laws, abolition, prohibition, the repeal of prohibition, civil rights and the expansion minority rights all being meaningless mirages? In your view this is because every hint of actual change is met with assassination or exile for some single protestor who matters more than every other?

If I’ve understood correctly, and with respect, I find these assertions absurd.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#369

Post by alickz »

throwaway744678 wrote: post #124
rvnx wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This verification process exists in Europe as well (it's called liveness verification), example: https://www.jumio.com/technology/live-detection/

The technology exists, right. But have you experienced it anywhere outside of China? I, for one, have not (at least in the UE). I strongly believe that the average western customer is not be willing to go through such a process.

I've had to add this exact functionality ("Look left and repeat these numbers") as part of KYC for a mobile app similar to Revolut.

This is in conjunction with ID scanning.

I think this functionality was necessary as part of complying with KYC laws. And AFAIK WeChat has very similar functionality to Revolut (among much more) so even if the app was non-Chinese (e.g. European), it would need a similar flow.

Re: Tencent deploys facial recognition to detect minors gaming at night

#370

Post by jrsj »

russli1993 wrote: post #254
gentleman11 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This company has a stake in many American companies. How chilling

Tencent is doing this to comply to Chinese laws. They won't do this if there is no such law. And the law says: "internet gaming companies have responsibility to not provide internet gaming service to minors between 10pm and 8am". I am sure tencent won't want to do this if they had the chance. 1) it limits their ability to get play time and sell to kids. 2) its more work on their end. So the main problem here is the l…

Also China would probably prefer American kids stay up all night playing games and fucking up in school etc
Post reply on HN