41–50 of 271 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
If it collects any data at all, it's surveillance. Anything else is a loophole.
> If it collects any data at all, it's surveillance Great, we just banned TCP.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Surveillance is needed to handle abuse of your service. Provide one example that can not be solved without surveillance.
Let's say you run a website with a sign on page. In order to log in a user typically you will run the password through an algorithm like argon2. Verifying a password for an account consumes CPU resources. A malicious may decide to DOS your site by just spamming this endpoint with bogus password to make you waste your time. An easy fix with surveillance is to rate limit people based off their IP address. Without surve…
This is your best argument why we have to track and profile every human on the planet around the clock?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because I don't want to waste the time of people who aren't interested in my ad in seeing my ad. It's a waste of money for me. The ad network will not be able to make money from having them click the ad. The user's time will be wasted because they are not interested in what I am selling. It's a lose lose lose situation. I want to create more win win win situations where everyone benefits. Tracking and profiling is ne…
You could target the same people by buying ad space in like-minded “venues”. There’s a gaping hole in the market for good “content-linked” advertising, searching, aggregation and so on. Link to content, not people. Work with customers who’re already self selecting, rather than following people around all the time. As a side-line, this’d probably cut back on a lot of click-bait trash articles. It, likely, would help b…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Surveillance is needed to handle abuse of your service. Provide one example that can not be solved without surveillance.
Let's say you run a website with a sign on page. In order to log in a user typically you will run the password through an algorithm like argon2. Verifying a password for an account consumes CPU resources. A malicious may decide to DOS your site by just spamming this endpoint with bogus password to make you waste your time. An easy fix with surveillance is to rate limit people based off their IP address. Without surve…
Pick a more sensitive area than your IDE, say medicine targeting erectile dysfunction, sexual or religious preferences, etc. You may find that being allowed to collect that data, especially covertly, just to save some money suddenly doesn't look reasonble at all.
But surely I should be allowed to covertly collect any data about you if it enables some savings for me. After 15 comments insiting it's OK you should only approve of this.
Do we have a good proposed legal definition of surveillance-based advertising?
The report defines it as >In this context, we use the term ‘surveillance-based advertising’ as a blanket >term for digital advertising that is targeted at individuals or consumer >segments, usually through tracking and profiling based on personal data. This is ridiculous. If I am trying to advertise an Elixer IDE, then I don't want my advertisements shown to any random person on the internet. The majority of users on…
This is known as contextual advertising.
Surveillance is not essential to internet advertising – in fact neither ROI, effectiveness or perceived relevance (when compared to all alternatives, including contextual advertising) has never been proven.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Good question. IANAL but how about this? Any ad which uses data about an individual, without full transparency about the data being used, to target them as an individual OR where such data is collected and stored and associated with an explicit or implicit identity.
“Data about an individual” is too vague, as is “to target them.” Would this ban search-based advertising? What about using an IP address to guess at a language? I think this can be done. I just don’t have the domain expertise to do it, and haven’t seen a proposed definition that made sense. The only intuition I have is around ephemeral versus permanent profiling.
More context: https://www.forbrukerradet.no/side/new-report-details-threat...
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Surveillance is needed to handle abuse of your service. Provide one example that can not be solved without surveillance.
Let's say you run a website with a sign on page. In order to log in a user typically you will run the password through an algorithm like argon2. Verifying a password for an account consumes CPU resources. A malicious may decide to DOS your site by just spamming this endpoint with bogus password to make you waste your time. An easy fix with surveillance is to rate limit people based off their IP address. Without surve…
Regardless, consider a DDoS attack. If every new request is coming from a different IP address, how do you continue providing service to your legitimate customers while blocking that malicious attack? Knowing the attacker's IP addresses doesn't do you any good... because they can just keep using new IP addresses, and blocking the old ones doesn't do any good.
This is where heavily surveillance-based systems like Google CAPTCHA often come into play, and I have very mixed feelings about those.
There are some non-surveillance-based captchas like this one[0] that I saw on HN awhile back, and I hope those become successful.
Do we have a good proposed legal definition of surveillance-based advertising?
The report defines it as >In this context, we use the term ‘surveillance-based advertising’ as a blanket >term for digital advertising that is targeted at individuals or consumer >segments, usually through tracking and profiling based on personal data. This is ridiculous. If I am trying to advertise an Elixer IDE, then I don't want my advertisements shown to any random person on the internet. The majority of users on…
Indeed, win-win that ads are targeted. Easily done on search engines because the query shows intent. Less obvious on the wider web but then perhaps it's the advertisers job to identify their market rather than rely on ad-network datapoints on visitors.
CPM/CPC ad payments are of course ripe for abuse by automation. CPA not so much.
Could potentially argue that the surveillance is essentially to make targeting more convenient for advertisers rather than being implicitly required to advertise. Market forces and ROI are surely the best measurement which CPA does a better job of doing. The problem with CPA is the trust required in order for the ad network to be paid.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Let's say you run a website with a sign on page. In order to log in a user typically you will run the password through an algorithm like argon2. Verifying a password for an account consumes CPU resources. A malicious may decide to DOS your site by just spamming this endpoint with bogus password to make you waste your time. An easy fix with surveillance is to rate limit people based off their IP address. Without surve…
Is is not surveillance - at the very least not in the relevant sense - if you maintain a temporary list of IPs you have seen in the past minute or hour. This is your best argument why we have to track and profile every human on the planet around the clock?
This is totally surveillance. Just because we delete data after a while, it doesn't mean I didn't surveil you, nor does it mean I haven't used that data I got from you for my own benefit.
>This is your best argument why we have to track and profile every human on the planet around the clock? You just asked for an example. If you are suggesting that my argument is to prevent abuse of systems I would say that it justifies tracking every person on the planet.