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Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

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Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#11
This is an ongoing tussle with the very legality of these rules being questioned. It's too soon to say what "lost liability protection" actually means. Twitter's responses (or lack thereof) have been a pain to deal with for the government.

What's not clear to me is who will be held responsible on the part of Twitter for any complaints. Earlier, Twitter had provided a local contact, which was that of a lawyer, as the contact for complaints and grievance redressal. That wasn't sufficient since the lawyer was not an employee of Twitter (as required by the new rules). He also left that position soon after. Twitter India has a managing director (MD), Manish Maheshwari, who claimed recently that he was only managing the marketing side and is not responsible for content moderation or anything else that happens on the platform. He was also granted a stay by the Karnataka High Court (which is where Bengaluru/Bangalore is) from arrest in a case filed in another state in the north (UP, i.e., Uttar Pradesh). [1]

I personally don't think Twitter India will find people taking up the positions of Resident Grievance Officer, Nodal Officer and Chief Compliance Officer. These are currently open positions on the Twitter careers page. [2] Whoever takes these up could end up in jail, which could really be bad with a draconian law like UAPA (Unlawful Activities Prevention Act) that allows people to be (arbitrarily) detained without recourse for very long durations. [3]

The new IT rules have also been challenged in court on a few different fronts. "Two of the government’s own legal advisers warned it that the new Information Technology (IT) Rules were beyond the scope of the law and required parliamentary approval." [4]

[1]: https://www.reuters.com/world/india/twitter-india-chief-wins...

[2]: https://careers.twitter.com/en/roles.html#location=careers-t...

[3]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawful_Activities_(Preventio...

[4]: https://outline.com/hCC7yg

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#12

Twitter is put on par with newspapers, because they do gatekeeping and have accepted bias. Twitter can not have the cake and eat it too. There is nothing sinister just the laws kicking in. You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral.

> You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral.

But Google does manipulate search results, so ostensibly they should also be put on par with newspapers?

examples:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27477797

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13274753

edit: Also your comment misleads on what the article reports. Twitter has not lost safe harbor because "they do gatekeeping and have accepted bias", but because they haven't met the staffing requirements imposed by India on large social media companies:

> The move comes as tension escalates between the Indian government and Twitter. Google, Facebook, and several other firms have partially or fully complied with the IT rules, which among other things, requires any significant social media firm (any firm with over 5 million users in India) to appoint a chief compliant officer, a resident grievance officer, and a so-called nodal contact person to address on-ground concerns.

> Twitter has not complied with any of these requirements, the court filing said. Twitter had no comment on Monday’s filing, but has said in the past that it intends to comply with the IT rules.

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#13
post #12

Twitter is put on par with newspapers, because they do gatekeeping and have accepted bias. Twitter can not have the cake and eat it too. There is nothing sinister just the laws kicking in. You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral.

> You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral. But Google does manipulate search results, so ostensibly they should also be put on par with newspapers? examples: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27477797 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13274753 edit: Also your comment misleads on what the article reports. Twitter has not lost safe harbor because "they do gatekeeping and…

how would one even sort search results without bias?

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#14
> Twitter said at the time that it was “concerned by recent events regarding our employees in India and the potential threat to freedom of expression for the people we serve”

I can smell the irony. These tech companies don't care about the liberties of the citizens of the America. Now they want to lecture the government of India and Nigeria (last month) about "freedom of expression"? What a pathetic joke. They took away the speech of mine and many others I know. I hope they suffer.

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#17
The article misses some more context.

1. The escalation intensified after tweets by prominent ministers and fucntionaries of the ruling government were marked as "manipulated media" 2. The IT Ministers and opposition partys accounts were locked for copyright infringement. 3. The govt wants twitter to comply on removing content and users critical of govt policies.

[1] https://indianexpress.com/article/india/manipulated-media-de...

[2] https://www.news18.com/news/india/copyright-infringement-twi...

[3] https://www.vice.com/en/article/jg8pzp/india-wants-more-cont... https://restofworld.org/2021/how-india-fell-in-then-out-of-l...

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#18

Twitter is put on par with newspapers, because they do gatekeeping and have accepted bias. Twitter can not have the cake and eat it too. There is nothing sinister just the laws kicking in. You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral.

Does google claim to be neutral? Does twitter?

Why should the attempt to remove some harmful content from their platform create a requirement to be absolutely perfect at doing so? Was there any doubt that twitter had the technical capabilities to remove some tweets?

If you ever help a person, are you then required to help any other person in the same situation?

What's the outcome you want? Do you believe it's possible to moderate billions of tweets without a mistake? If not, what's so great about social media that is overrun with swastikas and porn after the toxicity scared away all normal people? How does that help?

Do twitter employees maybe have the free speech right of not being involved in the distribution of stuff they find horrible? What's worse, your tweets being deleted by twitter or being forced to make statements you know to be wrong and harmful (i. e. coerced speech)?

Do you realise the standard for newspapers in the US is "actual malice", meaning the editors must know something they are publishing is false and harmful, and they must act with the intent to cause some harm. Is that how you'd describe "lost liability protection"?

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#19

Twitter is put on par with newspapers, because they do gatekeeping and have accepted bias. Twitter can not have the cake and eat it too. There is nothing sinister just the laws kicking in. You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral.

As mentioned by others, Google does "manipulate" search results too, but it is a slightly less sensitive/emotionalized topic because Google's content (web pages) is very different from Twitter's (personal utterances). The question is: what does "neutral" even mean in this context?

The dichotomy between neutrality and manipulation is artificial, although I do see the underlying assumption that the output of any algorithm would be "neutral" whereas manual interference with its results would be "manipulation".

In reality, however, the boundary is fluid. Would an algorithm that automatically excludes certain sites be neutral, while excluding the same sites manually is considered manipulation? Is "apply keyword search, then apply blacklist" an algorithm or manual manipulation? On the other side, is an algorithm that automatically penalizes SEO-optimized (spam) sites neutral, even though a search term occurs much more frequently on that given site?

Re: Twitter has lost liability protection in India, government says

#20

Twitter is put on par with newspapers, because they do gatekeeping and have accepted bias. Twitter can not have the cake and eat it too. There is nothing sinister just the laws kicking in. You wouldn't want google manipulating search results and then claim to be neutral.

Nothing sinister when demagogues want to shut down the free press to cement their own power?
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