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The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

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11–20 of 233 posts

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#11
In 10 years China will be the foremost global superpower.

I would urge everyone to be very carefully in their criticism of China or support of Taiwan.

Remember that what you say on the Internet can live forever. People are being cancelled for far less.

And China will not cancel in the way the West cancels. Instead of being fired, be prepared for your whole life to be destroyed, and maybe you being even imprisoned if you step in Asia (see Hong Kong security law).

So think before voicing support for lab leak theory, especially if you are science adjacent.

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#12
"Ever since the SARS outbreak of 2002-03, after all, paper after paper and countless popular pieces have warned that, sooner or later, nature would produce the next big SARS."

In 1995 Laurie Garrett warned about how the world could be brought to its knees by another airborne flu-like illness in "The Coming Plague".[1]

The first SARS and avian flu and swine flu, and CJD and mad cow disease were just more warnings that humans were continuing to play russian roulette with the way they were living with an using animals. Virologists knew this and warned about this, but the rest of the world chose to ignore them.

As things return to "normal" for the parts of the world lucky enough to get vaccinated it's likely that we're going to return to sticking our heads in the sand and pretending that this could never happen again, especially if we believe SARS 2 was created by humans instead of being just another natural disease... with probably a bunch more waiting in the wings.

[1] - https://www.amazon.com/Coming-Plague-Emerging-Diseases-Balan...

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#13

In 10 years China will be the foremost global superpower. I would urge everyone to be very carefully in their criticism of China or support of Taiwan. Remember that what you say on the Internet can live forever. People are being cancelled for far less. And China will not cancel in the way the West cancels. Instead of being fired, be prepared for your whole life to be destroyed, and maybe you being even imprisoned if…

China can't imprison people outside of its own borders.

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#14
post #6
post #2

It's kinda obvious that the 'lab leak theory' was created just to attack China.

Why is that? I find it equally obvious that China released the virus to attack the world. Exhibit A: China only have 92.000 cases total and no new cases in like a year. Point is I have a hard time believing what’s true or false when the ”fat cats dance”. Atleast it’s no secret that China have silenced doctors and people working in close proximity of the virus in the early days of discovering it.

You might have a point if China was the only country that was able to keep their case numbers low, but dozens of countries did even better than China. Perhaps South Korea or New Zealand is to blame instead.

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#15

In 10 years China will be the foremost global superpower. I would urge everyone to be very carefully in their criticism of China or support of Taiwan. Remember that what you say on the Internet can live forever. People are being cancelled for far less. And China will not cancel in the way the West cancels. Instead of being fired, be prepared for your whole life to be destroyed, and maybe you being even imprisoned if…

China can't imprison people outside of its own borders.

Why not? It certainly could under the “foremost superpower” scenario... like the US can today (e.g. Assange, McAffe, Meng Wanzhou (Huawei CFO), ...

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#16
The article opens by pooh-poohing the idea that three WIV researchers with flu-like symptoms in November might have had Covid-19, then a couple of paragraphs later asserts that it's well-known that Covid-19 was already circulating in Wuhan in November. Isn't there a contradiction there?

How widely accepted is the notion that Ebola is a bat virus? The last I heard (which was a while ago) the leading theory was a simian reservoir.

> What we’re left with is this: If the WIV had a secret strain (or strains) at least 99 percent similar to Covid-19, it got that raw material from the wild. That would mean there’s at least one wild virus that’s at least 99 percent similar to Covid-19 somewhere in nature, where humans had contact with it at least once. So far, it hasn’t been found, but it’s got to be out there, whether Covid is 100 percent natural or human-tweaked. So, given that Covid (or its direct ancestor) must exist in nature, it’s more likely that it got out naturally (like SARS and MERS) than that it took an undetectable detour through a secure biolab.

Is this really true? Everyone acknowledges that WIV researchers (quite openly and properly) sought out new coronavirus strains, including expeditions into remote mountains etc. to look for bat caves and take samples from bats that would probably never have otherwise had contact with humans. Everyone acknowledges that WIV cultured cells from its samples and worked closely with them under what were, at least in retrospect, inadequate (BSL-2) safety precautions. For a virus that we're all agreed must originate with a bat in a remote cave somewhere to get to a human, yes this is a more complex route than one lost bat biting a farmer or something. But I'm not sure it's really so much less plausible that humans who deliberately collected, studied, and worked closely with this virus for many man-hours might have slipped up once.

(We will probably never know for sure what happened - another thing that everyone acknowledges is that the PRC government destroyed a lot of potentially relevant evidence. On balance I think a purely natural origin is probably most likely, but I do think that the people who dogmatically shouted down any lab leak theory come off a lot worse than those who kept, and keep, an open mind)

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#17

In 10 years China will be the foremost global superpower. I would urge everyone to be very carefully in their criticism of China or support of Taiwan. Remember that what you say on the Internet can live forever. People are being cancelled for far less. And China will not cancel in the way the West cancels. Instead of being fired, be prepared for your whole life to be destroyed, and maybe you being even imprisoned if…

weird that you'd create an account to post something that basically amounts to a threat of retribution, in case someone posts something bad about China.

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#18
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China can't imprison people outside of its own borders.

Why not? It certainly could under the “foremost superpower” scenario... like the US can today (e.g. Assange, McAffe, Meng Wanzhou (Huawei CFO), ...

Even if so, I think it is a bit far fetched to image that China will go after pseudoanonymous commenters from 10 years plus in past on an American internet forum.

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#19

In 10 years China will be the foremost global superpower. I would urge everyone to be very carefully in their criticism of China or support of Taiwan. Remember that what you say on the Internet can live forever. People are being cancelled for far less. And China will not cancel in the way the West cancels. Instead of being fired, be prepared for your whole life to be destroyed, and maybe you being even imprisoned if…

No, I don't think I will.

Self-censoring just in case one of the most oppressive governments might get powerful enough to get you? That's the first step to making this a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Re: The Case Against the Covid-19 Lab Leak Theory

#20

In 10 years China will be the foremost global superpower. I would urge everyone to be very carefully in their criticism of China or support of Taiwan. Remember that what you say on the Internet can live forever. People are being cancelled for far less. And China will not cancel in the way the West cancels. Instead of being fired, be prepared for your whole life to be destroyed, and maybe you being even imprisoned if…

China can't imprison people outside of its own borders.

Wrong:

> Since 2017, it says, at least 695 Uyghurs have been detained or deported to China from 15 countries.

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2021/jun/25/b...

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