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The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

technologyreview.com

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Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#41
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't watched their Congressional testimony, but I've read Quay's "analysis" and heard Asher propound on his bioweapon theory elsewhere. Quay's analysis is not a rigorous Bayesian analysis in any sense. It's a series of subjective judgments about likelihoods of various scenarios. It's classic garbage-in, garbage-out, dressed up as science by using the word "Bayesian." The thing is, Bayesian inference is only as g…

There are actual virologists who support the lab leak theory, but my guess is that Congress is calling him because he is pushing it as an intentional lab leak. There is so far no evidence at all for that, and it doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Biological warfare is like trying to use a grenade as a handgun. Yes it does hurt your opponent, but... Yes China did seem to contain COVID well, but if it were (hypothetica…

> There are actual virologists who support the lab leak theory

Very few. I don't know of any major virologist who actually says it's more likely, and the overwhelming majority say it's highly unlikely.

Right now, everything points to the outbreak being associated with animal markets, just like SARS.

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#42

It really doesn't make a difference if covid came from a lab or not, or even whether it was released on purpose or not. No one will stand up to China whether they did this on purpose or by gross negligence. So no one will stand up to China. So nothing will change...

Could China have handled this better? Hell yes.

The thing is though, I seriously doubt the end result would have been any different if the virus has first come about in any other country.

Imagine that the virus has first been discovered in Atlanta (first US city that came to mind) - would officials really be brave enough to have a hard, immediate lockdown, with all the economic hardships that would entail, and with all the problems of getting a doubting populace on onboard? (keeping in mind that Trump's initial reaction was to denounce the very notion of a serious virus as a "hoax")

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#43
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should develop open source decentralized alternatives to it that are easy to use.

Honestly I think Mastodon is already about as easy to use as possible. The real problem is the network effect, and the fact that the average person really just doesn't care enough about the benefits you get from it. What we really need is a libre, decentralized social network that's "cool" enough that non-tech people would have FOMO if they don't join. That's a much harder problem, one that I certainly won't be able…

> Honestly I think Mastodon is already about as easy to use as possible. The real problem is the network effect, and the fact that the average person really just doesn't care enough about the benefits you get from it.

I care a great deal about the benefits of Mastodon! For me, the benefit is that anyone who is obsessive about conspiracy theories, racism, etc have a quarantined social space where they can converse without me having to listen.

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#44

It really doesn't make a difference if covid came from a lab or not, or even whether it was released on purpose or not. No one will stand up to China whether they did this on purpose or by gross negligence. So no one will stand up to China. So nothing will change...

The article is specifically discussing concerns with us funding of this sort of research. That is something that can change.

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#45
post #42

It really doesn't make a difference if covid came from a lab or not, or even whether it was released on purpose or not. No one will stand up to China whether they did this on purpose or by gross negligence. So no one will stand up to China. So nothing will change...

Could China have handled this better? Hell yes. The thing is though, I seriously doubt the end result would have been any different if the virus has first come about in any other country. Imagine that the virus has first been discovered in Atlanta (first US city that came to mind) - would officials really be brave enough to have a hard, immediate lockdown, with all the economic hardships that would entail, and with a…

> would officials really be brave enough to have a hard, immediate lockdown

To ask the question is to know the answer. Just imagine a public health official trying to convince the mayor or governor to quarantine a city of millions of people, based on a small number of pneumonia cases.

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#46

People will hate this source, but this is the most info I’ve seen revealed about the actual conditions in the Wuhan lab(s): https://www.the-sun.com/news/3174242/wuhan-labs-leak-covid-c...

That's because the source regularly deliberately misinforms. So it's impossible to know if literally any of the claims here are completely made up. For example: _In December 2019, The Sun's political editor, Tom Newton Dunn, wrote an article for the paper titled "Hijacked Labour", alleging that "Jeremy Corbyn is at the centre of an extraordinary network of hard-left extremists pieced together by former British intell…

Look up NYTimes and yellow cake.

Oh wait that doesn't fit your narrative. Oh well. I'm sure you have some explanation for why one is better then the other and it's a totally valid non partisan, non bias, totally fair minded reason.

hN is just full of highly propagandized group thinkers.

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#47
All: please don't post generic comments [1], and definitely not generic flamebait comments [2], in threads like this. Those are repetitive, tedious, and therefore off topic (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html). Edit: we don't want to just repeat the same argument over and over, because there's no curiosity in that [5], and because it usually turns nasty [6].

The value of an article (and thread) on a major ongoing topic, such as this one, is in the specifics of what the article discusses—in other words, the diff relative to previous articles and threads [3]. If there aren't any new specifics, then the article itself would count as off topic [4], but in this case there do seem to be.

[1] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

[2] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

[3] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...

[4] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...

[5] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...

[6] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#49

People will hate this source, but this is the most info I’ve seen revealed about the actual conditions in the Wuhan lab(s): https://www.the-sun.com/news/3174242/wuhan-labs-leak-covid-c...

If you want to know the actual conditions, there is a recent article from a much better source

Bloomberg: The Last–And Only–Foreign Scientist in the Wuhan Lab Speaks Out

She is an Australian virologist, now working in Melbourne’s Peter Doherty Institute for Infection and Immunity, previously scientific director of the biosafety lab at Singapore’s Duke-NUS Medical School in 2016.

Archive link:

https://archive.is/IFDZY

Re: The risky bat-virus engineering that links America to Wuhan

#50
post #42

It really doesn't make a difference if covid came from a lab or not, or even whether it was released on purpose or not. No one will stand up to China whether they did this on purpose or by gross negligence. So no one will stand up to China. So nothing will change...

Could China have handled this better? Hell yes. The thing is though, I seriously doubt the end result would have been any different if the virus has first come about in any other country. Imagine that the virus has first been discovered in Atlanta (first US city that came to mind) - would officials really be brave enough to have a hard, immediate lockdown, with all the economic hardships that would entail, and with a…

I wasn't really referring to their reaction to covid, rather their creation of covid.

Leaving aside the Lab origin theories, Covid 19 never would have happened if China had hygienic food supply-chains and banned wet markets.

That's where other zoonotic diseases have come from in recent years from China (SARS is the biggest example). They closed the markets, new viruses stopped happening and everything was fine. Then they opened the markets again and we got covid 19.

China is like a drink driver who already hit someone and refused to stop drunk driving and hit another person. Right now no one wants to make them stop driving. So I guess we'll just keep getting pandemics?

Covid 19 is really just SARS 2.0.

That's what really gets me here (sorry, I'm ranting now). China knew this would happen. Everyone did. And they did it anyway. And now everyone is pretending like it was bad luck or something!? This is literally why every other major, industrial country has food hygiene laws and minimal "Bush meat".

Thanks for listening to me shout into the wind.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndr...

Edit: I wonder if one of the reasons china is so unwilling to engage is to encourage people to think it was a bio-weapon accident (we'll never stop that happening) rather than just "the CCP is too weak and lazy to say no to old people who want bat soup". Conspiracy within the conspiracy! But I'm an idiot so probably not...

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