The first patent is described as a "system and method for performing an action on a structure in computer-generated data," which Apple says applies, for example, to tapping a phone number and being prompted options to call or look it up on the web. So they have basically patented the context menu. How broken can a patent system possibly become before it crashes an entire economy?
Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
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Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#32I think there's room to debate the second and third points. But with respect to the first point, Apple is using the patent system exactly as it was intended. Apple has been researching personal computing since it was founded, and invests heavily in figuring out exactly what works to make viable products. If Apple isn't entitled to patent protection for it's discoveries, I'd argue nobody is.
Which is a fine argument to make, but we should leave Apple out of it and say that even when a company uses the system as it was intended to be used, the system is broken. If Apple's victory over HTC is scary, the real conclusion is that all patents are scary, even those that protect companies doing actual research and who sell actual products.
Meanwhile, I think that Google are the actual villains. Do they spend billions dismantling the patent system? No. Do they spend billions protecting their partners from lawsuits? No. What they do is aid and abet other companies to violate patents, and then they shrug their shoulders and sell a few more text ads for Viagra or ambulance chasing lawyers.
Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
US market is kinda big.
Not only big, the biggest one. But given increase in costs (MS tax, now Apple tax, tomorrow who knows) at some point it could be more cost effective for HTC to stop paying anyone and just not sell in the states. WO patents are much harder to get and very expensive to keep, so no big problem there.
Statistics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_...) would disagree with you.
Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#34These patent stories get more and more ridiculous by the day. We need a major software patent amnesty event to just wipe the slate clean. Patents were originally for protecting tinkerers and original thinkers from getting their ideas ripped off by some corporation. I love myself too much to read through the meat of the patents but it sure sounds so vague and general to software in general. Any idiot who took CS101 co…
You were on a roll, saying people shouldn't have to innovate, then suddenly you worry about hampering innovation.
Which is it? You want to be able to copy freely instead of innovating, or you want innovation to be protected?
Many comments in these threads seem to think Apple woke up one day in 2007 with the completely obvious idea of an iPhone. That's not how it happened.
Apple had been researching hand held computing since the 80's, bringing the most advanced handheld anyone had ever seen to the market, and iterating the ideas of how the software should work and the usability of that software, in directions quite different from those pursued by others such as Palm or PocketPC focused on limited capabilities more in line with what that era's hardware could actually pull off.
The market wasn't ready for Newton then, but its ideas seeped into engineering consciousness, making its innovations seem "obvious" later. Eventually, physical technology caught up with Apple's ideas, enabling the iPhone and iPod touch.
The Johnny-come-lately copycats are close enough already without their copies having to be "slavish". Whining about this or that feature they can't copy isn't becoming. If inventing's so easy, invent something better that everyone else will complain, after they see it, is obvious.
Or, have the foresight or folly to go spend nearly two decades pouring money and hard work into a product the market isn't ready for, build a huge portfolio of research-driven ideas supporting making the product, finally bring a product to market that for the first time just "feels" to everyman it works exactly the way such a product should work, and then see how you feel about that twenty years of investment being protected.
Arguably, making something feel obvious is an art. What's not obvious is that obviousness can take so much work.
Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#35There are three salient questions: First, is Apple a troll seeking rents or a functioning entity that invests in research and seeks to make money from products? Second, are the patents valid given the current patent system and laws (prior art, obviousness, &c) or not. And third, is the current system broken? I think there's room to debate the second and third points. But with respect to the first point, Apple is usin…
These things are not a problem for the real innovation guys the USA likes so much. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2729720
Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#361. HTC and Moto were both sued by Apple concerning same two patents. Hence alleged infringement in OS.
2. If alleged infringement is in OS than Google might have a way in to the proceedings to invalidate patents on OHA members behalf..ie not what Apple wants to face.
3. HP by its purchase of Palm has similar patents, hence why Apple never went after Palm or HP.
Considering the way Google is currently shredding Oracle patents in the invalidation processes I have a feeling that Apple may be in for a surprise. why? Why do you think MS has been so careful not provoke any OEM to challenge them to a lawsuit? Its called do not expose patents to the opportunity to have them invalidated or narrowed in claims.
Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#37Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#38The first patent is described as a "system and method for performing an action on a structure in computer-generated data," which Apple says applies, for example, to tapping a phone number and being prompted options to call or look it up on the web. So they have basically patented the context menu. How broken can a patent system possibly become before it crashes an entire economy?
You must examine a patent based on the specific claims, not the title. Many people make this mistake and assume the patent is much broader than it actually is.
Does not mean no patents make sense (although I have yet to see one in software in algorithms; but meaningful hardware patents are not unusual). The system needs to be completely rethought. As of now, the software patent system is not only easily abused, but itself is an abuse of common sense.
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Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#39There are three salient questions: First, is Apple a troll seeking rents or a functioning entity that invests in research and seeks to make money from products? Second, are the patents valid given the current patent system and laws (prior art, obviousness, &c) or not. And third, is the current system broken? I think there's room to debate the second and third points. But with respect to the first point, Apple is usin…
They are abusing the patent system to push competitors out of the market. They used a trivial patent to do this, these things are not valid in Europe. These things are not a problem for the real innovation guys the USA likes so much. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2729720
Re: Why Apple’s ITC patent victory over HTC Android phones is scary
#40Lets shed some light... 1. HTC and Moto were both sued by Apple concerning same two patents. Hence alleged infringement in OS. 2. If alleged infringement is in OS than Google might have a way in to the proceedings to invalidate patents on OHA members behalf..ie not what Apple wants to face. 3. HP by its purchase of Palm has similar patents, hence why Apple never went after Palm or HP. Considering the way Google is cu…