British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers • Hacker News Board

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#111

Post by spamizbad » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:07 PM UTC

oneplane wrote: post #12

undfg wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's okay - if people care about this they will stop buying Apple products.

That is part of the problem: a lot of people just don't care.

Do they? I think most consumers assume if a 40 cent part breaks on their computer they will pay 40 cents plus labor plus some part markup - the same way car, HVAC, and other repairs work.

That's why when people's computers break they take them to get repaired in the first place. Otherwise, consumers would just be tossing their broken devices and buying a new one.

If you're fairly well-heeled you certainly have the privilege of forgoing repairs and just buying new ones. Lots of tech enthusiasts who cycle through devices every year probably aren't bothered. But normal people who don't get excited at the prospect of purchasing a new 3 or 4 figure device appreciate being able to get their machine back in working order for a few hundred max.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#112

Post by tremon » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

jandrese wrote: post #66

Aeolun wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, no, don’t mistake correlation with causation. They just always come together. Note: I have no idea what TPM even is.

A TPM is just a bit of memory that is "hacker proof" so you can store a private key with a guarantee that it can't leak out. You can then sign, encrypt, or decrypt using the key. They were controversial because it was originally thought they would be used to lock parts of your computer away from you, being used to do DRM and the like. At the end of the day the chips were hard to use, slow, and flaky enough that it di…

A TPM is much more than "just a bit of memory". It is a cryptographic coprocessor, with its own microcode and its own security domain.

And I don't think a fully-secured future for PC's is as impossible as you think. The primary reason this is impossible right now is because TPM's aren't ubiquitous (none of my machines came with one installed). That problem will be solved by Windows 11.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#113

Post by chadlavi » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

thank goodness those never need repairing and aren't essential, heavily-used pieces of hardware /s

This is as toothless/pointless as passing a law that says you have the right to a discrimination-free workplace, except that racism and sexism are ok. These exclusions make the law useless for most people.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#114

Post by ezconnect » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:15 PM UTC

emouryto wrote: post #16

Well, smartphones must be updated to include better spyware. And newer computers are also better locked down to allow better surveillance. So, the older ones can't break down fast enough! You don't want a repairable computer so creeps install, like, a Linux distro. You want disposable TPM machines with Windows 11 Home Edition and unstoppable "telemetry".

My Windows 10 Pro just got updated to Windows 11 for free via an update and I have no TPM module.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#115

Post by bruce343434 » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:16 PM UTC

z2 wrote: post #55

nerdawson wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TV manufacturers are responding, often clumsily and based on their self-interest (data collection), to what consumers want. Trying to find a dumb TV is like trying to find a car without a built in radio. You're welcome to leave it switched off. Smart TVs are dumb if they aren't connected to the internet. Some may be slow. Some may have a poor interface. I'd worry about solving for that rather than expecting manufactu…

The worry I have with these TVs is that basic functions like channel seeking or brightness controls now rely on a computer running Android. It feels like a 1000-fold increase in complexity and risk for something to hobble the TV part of the TV. Say the CPU overheats due to poor heat design after 3 years--it doesn't seem like manufacturers have a dumb mode to fall back on. Similarly, I'd be very worried if a car's rad…

Just get a seperate signal box and a big monitor?

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#116

Post by apk17 » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:17 PM UTC

jrkfkgmfmr wrote: post #89

z2 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The worry I have with these TVs is that basic functions like channel seeking or brightness controls now rely on a computer running Android. It feels like a 1000-fold increase in complexity and risk for something to hobble the TV part of the TV. Say the CPU overheats due to poor heat design after 3 years--it doesn't seem like manufacturers have a dumb mode to fall back on. Similarly, I'd be very worried if a car's rad…

The TV part of the TV requires a CPU anyway these days, because most cable signal or HDMI inputs are digital.

I hope very much that that CPU isn't running android, though.

I can't clock it, but our current TV seems to take longer to, well, turn on, than the tube tellys of yore.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#117

Post by varispeed » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:18 PM UTC

Why journalists don't call it as fraud?

They spent money on drafting this legislation and this is not fit for purpose.

But by the looks of it, big money must be behind it so it ticks the box, but does not actually change anything.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#118

Post by nitrogen » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:19 PM UTC

nerdawson wrote: post #85

gryn wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

or come integrated with an unremovable sim card that connects to a private Corporate APN.

There are a million things TV manufacturers could do that would be a problem but I think we should be focusing our attention on what they actually are doing. Hardcoding DNS for example which makes Pi-hole ineffective. That is increasingly happening and should quite rightly be criticised.

I think we should be focusing our attention on what they actually are doing.

It's absolutely necessary to try to anticipate the future, because the future always becomes the present. If we don't try to anticipate, we will be stuck with whatever is given to us. Like the introduction of ads on Android TV.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#119

Post by apk17 » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:21 PM UTC

gorjusborg wrote: post #39

kleiba wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't own a smart TV, so this question is probably a bit naive - but what happens if you don't connect your smart TV to the internet?

If the incentives stay strong enough, they'll likely just build in 'free' mobile data to bypass your network. Faraday cage or soldering iron, anyone?

Our TV started to complain that the Wifi module was unplugged (which apparently is on the main board). Problem: This happened regularly with a dialog box. 'Solution': Put a Wifi dongle in the USB port.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#120

Post by tremon » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 5:22 PM UTC

alias_neo wrote: post #86

Silhouette wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're in the UK and an expensive phone really did break just from falling 4 inches after one week, I'd be tempted to try returning it to the seller. There must be a credible argument that it's unfit for purpose if it can be broken that easily due to a design flaw. It's not as if you carelessly dropped it from a pocket at waist height onto a concrete floor or something.

I tried, it was from Amazon and neither they nor Oneplus cared how or why it happened, I tried arguing that it was ridiculous that it happened but again, deaf ears, so I just let it be.

Next time, perhaps try a reputable seller?